Tuesday, December 9, 2008

Pink Truth: Mary Kay Letter Writer - or - Pink Truth Straw Man? You Decide

Pink Truth Posts "hate" Mail, supposedly from someone in Mary Kay... Think they would ever post something from this site?

So, is this a real letter from someone in Mary Kay?

Is it fabricated by the minds of Pink Truth?

Do you agree with the writer? A little? A lot?

What do YOU think about Pink Truth?

What do YOU think about Mary Kay?

Your REAL thoughts are always welcome here!


  1. They do post hate mail every so often. It used to be once a week but that got old. I don't know what each and every such piece of mail looks like...they did post one that was well written and not hateful. The majority of the ones they post are those that are very poorly written and are peppered with excessive punctuation.

    If someone wants to post a letter to PT with statements countering what Tracy claims, then I recommend not using any phrases like "you just had to work your business" or anything else that is a script/part of a script/shows up in countless emails over and over but doesn't contain actual information.

    I recommend them to come up with their own original statements and use statistics from their own work experience rather than those published by MKC. I realize people don't want to post their 1099 forms because tax information is pretty personal and you can't just go around putting personal stuff online where anyone can get their hands on it...but a statement like "I bought X inventory, I sold X products, and my business expenses were X, leaving me with a true profit of X" would be a good way to go IMHO. PT always says "give us the real numbers" so...suppose someone does?

  2. its possible that someone did try to give somthing with info like you suggest..but she just did not post it or let it be seen.

  3. Miranda, you were on pt for awhile, no letter will make it. Whether it be respectful, whether it has perfect punctuation is written by the President of the United States, or docutments personal figures with evidence, solid evidence such as one's Schedule C.

    If I were intelligent enough to be able to document all the requested "proof", I would be smart enough not to share this information with the world especially in this day and age with check fraud and identity theft.

    Unless the letter supports the cause or makes the pro mker look like a nut. It will not be shared.

    I am sure many have said evil things but the only and yes I mean the only place I have ever seen pt'ers referred to as "lazy losers" were pter's calling themselves that because that what they think other mkers think about them.

    For the record, so will enjoy Mary Kay, others won't enjoy Mary Kay. It will work for some, it will not work for some. Some will receive good advice and still do silly things, others will receive bad advice and figure out how to do it right.

    If someone decides Mary Kay isn't for them, one would not have known unless they tried it. So they tried it, they didn't enjoy it so they quit. There is nothing wrong with that. If one hated something and continued to do it, that would raise a question (as far as MK).

    I don't think any less of a person that decides to leave her Mk business than I do of my good friend who just quit her job as a bank teller to to something else. It is just a change of job, not a change of character.

    And from reading other blogs in anti mker and anti pter's, I believe many of the letters are not written by a Mary Kay person sent to pt. I do think some (not) all are manufactured in house. In the past, I noticed the hate mail would go up when the activity went down. It almost appeared to be a ratings booster.

    This is simply my opinion, nothing more, nothing less. I have no proof as to whether they are legimate or not and actually.

  4. Someone called PinkVixen who is pro MK is posting comments today and hasn't gotten deleted. She's under the post regarding what happened to product knowledge, second post down from the top. People who come across reasonably do get posted from time to time, like the person last month. (don't know what makes the difference in who does and who does not. Mood?) As to fake letters, I couldn't tell you. It is possible. Not necessarily true, but possible. Some of them do look horrible enough to make you do a double take. I was never exactly in the inner circle over there so that leaves me doing guesswork.

    No seriously, I wouldn't post personally identifiable info either. Just numbers with personal stuff removed.

    Did they really get rid of the flip chart? I always used mine. I also bought a little book about what cosmetic ingredients were and what they did so I can answer questions. Is MK still providing that book for consultants?

    I didn't manage to sell much when I was in, but I promise I really did learn about product ingredients, application, usage, what kind of skin needed what kind of products, blabla. Too bad I suck as a salesperson.

    Hey, is PinkVixen from over here? Bueller? Anyone?

    I gotta go now and get more coffee and correct these test forms. I'll check back in later. I was up too late doing holiday cards. I'm still not done, but I ran out of cards and envelopes and I also ran my green glitter pen out of ink.



  5. The flip chart is back, and I am glad. When the Company discontinued it, my unit and I would find updated product pics and laminate them and update our former flipcharts. We did this for as long as we could but it reached a point the updated, updated, updated, etc... flip chart look awful so we finally retired them. Just when we finally stopped missing them, the Company brought them back.

    I feel these are a vital tool of being a consultant. Once you are seasoned, maybe not so much but for a newer consultant it is like a security blanket or cue cards and yet you still look professional using it.

    Last note to Miranda: I can't answer for sure because you are friendly and entertaining in your posts, you know the product, (not sure if you loved and believed in the product) but if there is any truth in the D-I-S-C personality test, you said you ended up being a D/S if I remember correctly? ..any how, if you notice both of the are TASK orientated personalities not PEOPLE orientated and honestly that just could be the major part of it. (Not trying to psycho analyze, just a hunch). :)

  6. I am so completely not a people person in the usual sense of the word. I have tons of friends, and once you get to know me I'm a blast, but that does not mean I make friends really fast or easily. Talking with strangers = head splodey. I'm at a loss then.

    Pink Vixen is still going on PT and not getting deleted; I just checked back. She points out that she keeps minimal inventory, collects customers' money first, then orders their products. This sounds like a really important factor, and something I probably should have done. The big inventory orders were a big mistake. My director thought it was a good idea, but no...not so much. Big inventory was big crash and burn. X(

    Something else no one told me to consider, which is becoming apparent all of a sudden from your posts and PV's: What kind of friends andneighbors does a prospective consultant have? Affluent? Broke? gregarious? introverted? What are their cosmetic tastes? Are they people who would want to be customers and would recommend their friends to buy from you, or people who would run screaming from cosmetics at a certain price point and with a certain image? PV looks like she has a great big customer base and is selling, not recruiting. She looks like she is honestly doing fine.

    Put it like this...if my personality is wrong to sell MK, think of how even *more* wrong my friends' personalities and budgets are for buying it. Nobody ever mentioned that to me, and it never struck me at the time.

    I have a friend who sells Mark. I think it's just a hobby for her, but she doesn't lose money. No inventory up front, for one thing. No recruiting. The makeup is an appropriate line at an appropriate price for the women she hangs out with: Cute and inexpensive. The same goth girls who get their clubbing makeup from MAC will buy a cute sparkly pink lip gloss in a cute tube in a heartbeat. Weird dichotomy, yes, but it's true.

    I'm never going to try selling makeup again, but when I look back at it, I really should have tried Avon. It's far lower priced. The Avon girls all do the same thing: Hand out catalogs and their email addresses/phone numbers. The catalog is usually sitting at a front desk somewhere and then people like me walk by and get interested. There's not a skin care class or even much contact with the sales girl. You just order by email, leave your check in an envelope, and she delivers to that same front desk and you get your bag of stuff. It's a method for introverts. I go up to the desk and grab the catalog to see what's cool, and inevitably I go OMG THERE IS A TWO FOR ONE ON LIPSTICKS and then I email the girl and...yeah you know the rest.

    oh wel, live and learn.

  7. i agree with that method. I have mentioned on one of these topics that what I do is collect money up front, then place my order also, especially when I first meet someone. I stictly follow the 60/40 rule and I order a little extra with each order so that I can keep the popular products on my shelf and build that way. You dont have to use credit all the time and go into debt to sell MK, like PT wants everyone to think. Investing in some inventory up front is good, but after the initial investment, one should have enough activity to keep orders coming in so that your business will float itself with the sales. In order to have activity (bookings) you have got to step out of the confront zone at some point if you want to have a consistant business. You can get orders by leaving your beauty book at the front desk or in the break room (like the AVON reps do), but you cannot build your entire MK business on this kind of activity. Just like you can't build on family and friends. Sure they will buy from you every once in a while, but you have to branch out. You cant always take a passive sales approach.

    Getting referrals is the best way to keep your business going, IMO. If I have a $100+ facial, my thinking is that if this lady will spend this much on herself, then surely she has some friends that may be able to do the same. I am sure PT can spin this as manipulative, but IMO it is good business sense.

    As far as the letter, I think it is real. Its not full of obvious cult like praise for MK like some of the fake letters are. And I agree with a lot of what she has to say.

  8. My referrals never panned out. :( Either they turned out to be too broke to afford MK stuff, or they stood me up, or they would say "I'm not sure why what's-her-face gave you my name, but I'm not interested."

    Tried the fishbowl, too. Got like 30 names. Of those, let's see, like 10 bookings resulted, of which 3 held. The rest either stood me up or called and cancelled and then did not want to reschedule. Of the 3 that held, one had no purchases, one had minimal purchases, and one had moderate purchases.

    The last one that stood me up indirectly resulted in an expensive doctor visit...I was running around vacuuming the living room expecting their arrival a bit later, barefoot like always when I'm alone, and I jammed my pinky toe into the couch HARD. These ppl never showed up and didn't answer the phone, so then I hopped in the car with one shoe on and went to the emergency clinic. The toe wasn't broken, but the bone was bruised. MAN that sucked.

  9. man I hate when I stub a toe!! thats a kind of pain that hurts all over!

    I tried the fishbowls and i had some success with it, but you really have to gage where you put them.

    the things you mention, everyone has had those experiences. I have had classes where no one came, I have had classes where I did not have enough mirrors to go around. the thing is that when you first start out, these dissapointments happen and its easy to get discouraged. But its not your fault or the fact that MK is flawed. Its just the nature of business...period. Each person has to decide for themselves if it is worth it to keep going and see it through, because it wont always be that way. Some consultants dont stick around long enough to realize that. PT will point to any business disappointment as if to say "see, i told you Mary Kay doesnt work..get out now while you can.." And new consulatants being discouraged and scared will get out and not realize that with proper training, they can make it through the tough parts.

    Referrals are just like anything else. you have to work them full circle. I have had most pan out, but some that did not. I always tell people to let the referral know that I will be calling and that usually helps.

    And branching out of your own income bracket is a good idea, but if you are convinced that it wont work, then you are right..they probably will "smell the brokeness" like you said on your other comment (LOL)!
    I know you dont plan on doing it again...but to those that are reading this that are thinking about it..confidence is the key. We are taught in my unit that those women who are intimidating (look like they can afford the product, well put together, professional women..) are the ones who we should consider targeting because they can probably afford the product and most dont mind treating themselves. But you must have confidence when approaching them. If you are so busy being preoccupied with yourself, and feeling that you dont measure up, then you may not do so well. How many top directors in MK started out broker than broke,so broke they couldnt pay attention..but no one knew it and they made it work.
    If we only offer the products to those we are confortable with,(usually those in the same financial situation as us) we wont sell much. To me this is the true meaning of "fake it till you make it". It doesnt mean spend money you dont have to look successful, but its just that no one has to know your true financial situation and you must appear confident.

    Also you must believe in your products that you are selling. If you dont like them, then others can tell and you wont sell much. Just focus on others and they will see you are geniune and listen to your sales pitch. If they dont want to, then dont take it personal and move on to the next potential client.
    One of the most valuable lessons I have learned in MK is not to take it personnal. Just move on. What one woman wont buy, someone else will.

  10. And by the way, I know a lot of AVON reps. They have the same pitfals as any other home based business. It may seem easier to sell than MK because its cheaper, but I know of one AVON rep who said she still ran into people not paying her as promised etc.. This was a problem because she had so many days to get AVON the money because the company had fronted her the products.
    IMO it doesnt matter what the price of something is. If someone really wants something, they will find a way to pay for it.

  11. I'm lucky I never got stiffed. That at least I can say.

    The Avon girl...what she's got to do is take the customers' checks to the bank and make sure they clear first! It sux to have to be so skeptical, but...sigh. I had a friend who did not collect and deposit the money up front and some kooky woman ordered 15 Sweet Honesty perfumes and then changed her mind...leaving my friend holding the bag. X(

    I'm confident in certain circles, which is to say basically like minded people. i r geek. Sci fi fans, tabletop gamers, alterna-people. Put me in with "normal" ppl and it's going to get weird. Not because I have no manners, but I just find...even if I dress and do my hair and my makeup "normal" people can tell when you are looking like something that you're not. But my director would have had a heart attack if I'd run around doing classes in all black and stompy boots so I "disguised" myself.

    Tomorrow's payday. I know I need to be a good girl and watch the budget, but I *am* tempted to pop over to Ashley's Mark page and see what she's got that's good. I am a great big makeup junkie.

    psst, have you guys tried Maybelline Colossal mascara? I <3 it!

  12. Hey all, is everyone just loving the Holiday season?? Gosh, people even seem to be more polite in the crowds these days!

    anywho, Mirando, you are too funny. Forgive me if I overstep but from reading your posts,(sort of think you can take and and will understand my intent - and realize you would tell me to shut up if I am overstepping) - I sort of think that one of the reasons MK didn't work for you is you weren't being true to yourself. You had to conform to the "norm". It is not who you are, you had to have been uncomfortable, and that doesn't translate into confidence. I believe that if people don't feel your confidence in your product and in yourself they are far less likely to "buy what you are selling" - no matter what it is.

    I love this product and this Company, I am told over and over again that "oh I can see how much you believe .." I am not rich, my clients range from people that buy a mascara on a payment plan to people that drop $200 every 3 months. (I am hanging on to middle class - thank goodness gas prices went down).

    You know I bet that if you had done your MK in your circles in your comfortable attire,(your goth look) you would have done far better than you did feeling totally uncomfortable. And I can tell you, my liquid black eyeliner, ultimate black mascara, and oil free eyemake up remover is a huge success with my goth group.

    Question for you, from reading, I never get the feeling that you really loved the products before you decided to try and sell them?
    Were you using them and did you love them?

    What made you want to try consultanting?

    On a seperate note, I have an aunt and I friend who sells Avon, it might be easier to just leave a catalog around but I know that the orders I get if I sit down and do a facial or a class and show people how to use the products far exceed the orders they get from just leaving a catalog around.

    I helped my friend do your Schedule C for her Avon business, and even if I wasn't a director, ikes, I would certainly stick with MK, from looking at what she showed me, you better really be hustling if you are looking at making any real type of money.

    Have any of you watch that show on TV "Blush"? it is cool.

  13. u r so right! I learned quick not to take checks for granted. I think in my 10 years of being in MK, I have had 5 bad checks. all of them went on and made good, one actually went to the prosecuting attorney's office for collection. I have a check collection agency connected to my business account and they will collect on any bad checks written to me, including prosecuting the check writer if she doenst pay up. I make sure everyone knows this before they even think about writing me a bad check! and just like you say, unless I now the person, most of the time I will take the check to thier bank and cash it before I deposit it into my account.

    That is why I love Propay, I can process thier credit card from my cell phone or computer while they are waiting!

    I dont know about your director. I think you would have done just fine if you had worn your makeup in all your goth glory at your classes, especially if your clients were like minded. You would have been more comfortable and when you are confident and comfortable you have the chance to do more and make more sales.

    I also understand about matching your audience. But if it wasnt for you, then it just wasnt. No biggie. But its obvious that you really like the art of make up, so do I. I am always on the internet looking at videos of eye makeup applications and other makeup tips. My favorite is the makeupgeek.com and her tutorials on youtube. I know she uses a lot of mac products, but i have been able to recreate some of them using MK!

  14. To answer questions here...I was using MK because it was something new I was trying. The drugstore makeup at the time was lousy, and I was out in the country then and couldn't get to Sephora and everything. I liked the MK color cosmetics quite a bit and I liked the gentlest skincare. I hated the foundation because it just would NOT behave. If a single tear ran down my face in the wind, the whole thing was blotchy and destroyed. Couldn't touch up; the foundation would get...opaque? messed up looking. Had to start over. I hated all the treatment products because my skin swelled up and reacted to them, especially my eyes would burn and itch and tear up. I was really unhappy with the brushes they had at the time. So it comes out like/dislike about 50%. (1995, FYI). why I became a consultant is that I thought that selling makeup would rock because I loved makeup. My receptionist job that I had then was just terrible and I got treated like crap and I thought "hey, let's try selling makeup. Maybe this will be a better way to make money." I also figured I would not be dealing with men making thinly veiled passes at me because MK is mostly composed of women.

    It killed me when they told me I couldn't touch people's faces. What I wanted to do is demonstrate for them on one half and then have them duplicate the technique on the other. But no. :( Why not? I found out that the clinique and MAC girls are not licensed cosmetologists or anything, and they do makeovers. Heck. I do makeovers for free now at my house.

    My job was already making me "fake it" so I just kept on doing it for MK except being a weekend warrior at the club and stuff. That's until I got a better job where they weren't so hung up on conformity.

    uh...am I forgetting anything? I'm all scattered. It's a lousy day because I got my debit card number ripped off. But yr right, I do not have thin skin and I don't get easily offended over little nothings. If nothing else, an alternative subculture will teach you really fast to develop humor and have thick skin. I hear stuff all day.

    Random guy: "Oi, Morticia! Halloween's over!"

    Me: *stare* "YAAAH! I'll turn you into a toad! Wait. you are already a toad. so sorry."

    What about cream eyeliners...the really stay put kind like Stila and MAC make? One little tear and liquid liner is everywhere. MK could probably sell the heck out of some cream liner if they make sure it isn't irritating and doesn't run.


For Further Reading...

This Week On Pink Truth - Click Here
Pros and Cons of Mary Kay - Read or Contribute or Both!
First Post - Why I Started This Blog
The Article I Wrote For ScamTypes.com (here) (there)
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