Friday, July 3, 2009

Similiarities - or is it Personalities??

When I write I do try to be fair and objective, I may not always succeed but I do try. So please take this simply as observation not an outright attack.

The last several days as I have been reading the posts on pt - the one on ethics, the ones on mlms and the newest on cults. Does anyone one else see the irony of many of the comments? I have been moving away from "disagreeing" with their view points as a way to direct our articles but as I read this grouping, I actually had alot of compassion and sympathy for many of them. (no, I haven't lost it - I will explain). As I read and see the character's personality develope, I see what they loved about MK being recreated on pt and then I see everything they accuse MK of being guilty of doing, being down on pt. I don't want to write a whole book but my first point. The thing that got many so financial doomed in MK was their need for recognition and the respect of their peers or the prizes... Now parrallel it to the commenters swooning over the author of the daily posts, oh "prune", so eloquaint, you have such a gift for words, applause, applause, oh my you are the best, you are so awesome, and you can "see" the authors blushing and just eating it up. Most have this insatiable need for kudos and praise. Now they are not getting it from Mk so they have moved on to pt. They speak as strongly about pt now as they did MK, and then when they cross the line on pt, they will then be devasted again and find another "fix".

Cult think, - go ahead and voice a different opinion - just as fresh out of pink and nutmeg did, don't agree or don't word it right, you are going to be slammed into seeing things their way. Of course, it is now not "listen to your director, etc.." It is listen to us and listen to the tough love of tc. Be too dumb to doubt, just believe us. We love you, we are your friends?? friends?? yes over time we can make internet friends (waving to Miranda) but posting anonomously on a blog doesn't equal a friend. They trusted and got hurt in Mary kay, and now they are trusting and many once again will get hurt on pt. Let them deny it but... come on, yes the are anti MK sites, but there are anti - anti Mk sights!These sites are ex members of pt who formed an anti pt site Duh, ptlies, my pink truth read some of their testimonials and stories, there would be no reason for them to make stuff up. As we are accussed of putting Mary Kay on a pedestal, tc is also put up on a pedestal. Seriously if you would like to see my point bop on a read freshoutofpink's first comment... wow by the time you get to her last comment, you would have thought she came in and raped, pilered, and pundered. (Now mind you she is already feeling "lost" because she now "feels" her MK assosciations have abandoned her, now an internet group just slap her, her need to "belong" is so strong, it sounds of if she is down on her hands and knees, kissing butt, apologizing, confessing, groveling, oh my how sad, it just looks like she thought she was going to feel left out and sad and "nobody" wants me all over again.

On to issues that they have with some of the seminar suggestions:
I go to Seminar, I have learned alot when I attend my classes, (off topic sentence) I would like to share if you happen to be in a class and it just isn't "doing it for you", slip out and slip into another one. Get all the information that you can and if you aren't connecting with the speaker , you aren't going to be learning that much. (return to thought)If you take your Mary Kay seriously and take it like a business, why in the world would you want to take your family along? Yikes, could you see a whole bunch of businessmen showing up a board meeting dragging his wife and kids. And the consultant that brings family might love and adore their kids, but I may not, I paid for the conference and i dont want to be distracted by someone else's child. I remember last seminar a group of pters were going to travel to Dallas and "protest" and pass out pt cards to all seminar attendees. lol A non business/non paid trip without the business to use the expenses of the trip as a write off. Are they going to leave their kiddies at home or drag them to Dallas and lock them in the hotel room or plant them in 100+ degree heat in downtown Dallas in July. So they are ready to drop all this money. Hm, see why there could have been money issues while they were in MK?

I have seen more religous manipulation and using scripture to "boost" their opinin than in mK- hey isn't that the pot calling the kettle black? If one is going to cram scripture down others "eyes" don't contradicte youself. Love this sentence by "prune" - "I WILL FOREVER HATE MARY KAY FOR THIS. It Righteous anger!"

Nothing done wrong is ever one's fault now that they are on pt, it was someone else's fault because that is what they were taught. The "model" is flawed..psshhh - but the same as we in MK are always accussed of sounding the same - do you see that everyone is saying "exactly the same thing" on pt -they all sound the same (isn't that what they say about us kaybots?)

Not disclosing the "whole" truth in MK according to pt is lying. Something misspoken - watch out, you may receive the golden boot award. (No -the last couple of years we can not say that "Mary Kay is America's Best Selling Brand of Skin Care and Color in the Us based on the statics and info based on ind. company xyz..because we didn't participate. But there was a time this was a legal statement. It just isn't current. I see pters get very emotional when a consultant says that MK is taught at Harvard. no - not quite there was a marketing case study - but I could see where someone not paying attention could misquote the the message and their is a "seed" of truth in it. And at last years seminar several universities and colleges had people their to study the principales of the Company. My POINT - Mary Kay is always telling us NOT to over sell, not to exaggerate, to make sure we have our wording correct - they don't support misinformation.

Half truths run all the way thru pt... the one thing that always amuses me - the $ amount of product returned to MK. MK reports sales yearly - to report the returns and not note that it is not just the annual offset it is the cummulative fiugre from the beginning of pt could lead people to believe pt has had a far greater impact on MK than it has.

Another point, MK scripts are always being made fun of... Now - author black nova rights her "script" that she uses when she is invited to a direct sales, party, everyone is now going to use her script because the words are so perfect. lol -

Absolutely love this... pro mkers argue, one shouldn't have argued if you didn't need the product... or but the pressure, yada yada yada... but.... if some ask you to attend a party... here is the response: "Be strong - Just Say No" - intersting,huh?
They did make my chuckl because all mlm's are boycotted EXCEPT the newer "pleasure parties with their sex toys" - I guess it is okay to bend the rules if you want huh... pleasure?

See the similiarities? PT is what they had recreated without the product. It is just like a parrallel universe. It was just the grouping of these articles and seeing that common thread that did help me to see how several ended up so "duped".

We get made fun of for wearing MK sweatshirts pins, (advertising) but something that is so stupid in mk is now a great idea to buy a pt t-shirt?? okay spend money to advertise something that is not even going to give you a snowballs chance in H*ll to earn a dime. We are ridiculed for "warm chatting or stalking" when we pass out a business card or offer someone a facial. But isn't passing out a pt card to unexpecting person still intruding on their space and still soliciating? I think it would be more annoying to have some approach me and hand me a business card "warning" me of the dangerous of mk - at least if she gets hand an MK business card, she at least nows what she is saying yes or no too.

What I see is the "birds of a feather, flock together". It isn't the business model. It is the personality type, and they are going to end up "addidicted to whatever is making them feel full in their lives at the time. This is the type of individual that is probably susceptible to cult followings as they are easily lead. Perhaps the personality types that are stonger or more analytical don't end up on pt. The stories sound so similiar because the personalites are so similiar, imho.

In closing, rb, askes this question: "Many of us here were "successful" by Mk standards but not by our own. For ethical statement might be, Suzy, this is the last day of the month, and although our Unit could use the production under today's date, you actually lose one entire month of active status. If you are planning to keep selling weekly, this wont affect you, but if you think you will be struggling with new contacts after your perfect start and intend to go slowly,it would serve you best to put the order in on the 1st of the month to have the entire 90 days of active status. True or not true? And who among us has ever uttered those words? ( maybe no one answered her on pt but I would like to answer her, yes, I have and many of my sister directors, - our theory, care about others and you will be rewarded 10 fold. It has proven to be true over and over again.


  1. Excellent post!! Thanks for writing this Mk4me. I am glad that you were able to put into words what I was thinking too. I read the posts by nutmeg and FOP; I felt so sorry for the way they were being lambasted. It is so true-- there is a "cult" mentality on PT-- believe as we believe or you don't belong, or "you'll come around, once the 'pink fog' is lifted to thinking our way." huh?? I did see there were some anti-PT sites, where those who had disagreed with the leaders had been kicked off. So much for freedom of speech and being an open forum!

    The "active" thing, I think that it is admirable for directors to inform their consultants about this, but I also believe an IBC needs to take responsibility for knowing her business. I still don't get why if you are serious enough about your business to invest at a star level or even a qualified order, that you cannot take some time to read through the educational materials on intouch and learn your business. Plus, I think if someone was actively pursuing their business, it wouldn't be such a big deal to stay active. Those that are personal use, can just plan their big orders accordingly!!

    Oh, the other thing I wanted to comment on is the Harvard thing. There has been actual case studies done of MK-- you can look them up on the internet for goodness sakes!! Pters take things so literally. No, there is not a class devoted to MK, but the business classes have studied a "case study" regarding the MK business model. In addition, there is even a book out written by a professor, who mentions in his book that his classes looked at the MK business model: "More than a Pink Cadillac: Mary Kay's Inc.'s Nine Leadership Keys to Success" by Jim Underwood It can be found at amazon:

  2. Oh luckylawgirl, it seems our minds think very similiar thoughts! I do find it amusing some get so upset about the "lie" that MK philosophy is taught at Harvard. - Seriously, was that one of the reason you joined MK? I know it wasn't a reason for me.

    Yes, it does seem that everything is taken so literally. - Don't ever have dry sarcasim, don't have a dry sense of humor, don't be a smart aleck and say something for shock factor because someone may quote you or misquote you and you will be accussed of lying.

    Please know folks if you ever hear me say, I am sooooo hungry I could eat a horse. - I am not lying to you - I have no intention of eating a horse. :)

    Or it is raining cats and dogs, no worries, you will not have to call the spca :)

    Mary Kay herself had a wonderful sense of humor. A quiet sense. I have seen some of her humor taken so far out of context and twist, that I just shake my head.

    Last point, it is funny when a lurker (usually a pro-mker) finds pt and writes a "polly anna" puff comment. (got to admit sometimes they even make me gag, but many get mad, "why didn't she read the "about us" page,it clearly says we are not pro mker, we are mk haters.... " and the fact that a newbie post before reading surprises them why? How many that say they didn't know this, that, or the other think while in MK never read their consultants guide, the Applause magazine, the product guide, Learn MK, Marykayintouch, or even the Look Book??? okay deviled eggs are ready, on our way to our first party of the weekend!

  3. Oh I love deviled eggs!! MyDH and I belong to a local country club (very low key and in NO way a fancy place). I am currently sitting in a lounge chair by the pool :-) oh the life!!!
    Glad to have someone to chat with about things!! I would be willing to post as well, but don't know how--

  4. I will get a message to Dave, he is the blog owner, he loves different personlities!

  5. luckylawgirl,

    First of all, welcome!

    Second, sorry it has taken me so long to welcome you to the site, but it seems that you are fitting in quite nicely!

    Third, if you would like to seriously consider being an author here - and as mk4me has mentioned, we do like to have a good mix of personalities - please send an email to

    Basically, I need your email address to invite you to become an author, so make sure you send me the email address that is associated with the profile you would like to use. It is easy, painless and - judging by the way you enjoy asking for responses - will be a lot of fun.

    Thanks, and again, welcome!


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