Tuesday, March 25, 2008

Women can't survive in a man's world...

It is interesting to me that the majority of the comments that come in on any site - pro-, anti-, or otherwise - demonstrate a total lack of understanding of how business works.

It is sadly ironic to me that the one thing that Mary Kay Ash aimed to do - offer women an opportunity to compete in a predominantly "man's" world - is the one thing that participants and ex-participants balk at.

To sum it up, it sounds like this to me:

- "I am woman, I am strong, get out of my way..."
- "I am going to crush the competition..."
- "Wait, what? I have to make how many phone calls?"
- "I did AAALLLLL this work, and nobody is buying from me..."
- "The problem can't be me... I am great.... it must be something else..."
- "It's my directors fault"
- "It's Mary Kay's fault"
- "I am going to go back to what I was doing before... it was easier - at least there if I don't get results I still get a paycheck"

Sorry Mary Kay Ash, despite everything that you and your company have done to demonstrate that woman CAN compete in the general market, women are still copping out.


  1. I think I am so over tired, I will come back and make a logical post after some sleep until then In the Wise words of Helen Redy, I am Women... I am strong ...strong... I am ivincible...invincilbe.. I am woman, you can bend but never break me because it only serves to make me more deteremined to acheive my final goal....oh yes, I've paid the price.......
    ...(thinking...hmmm, think I have the 45 in a storage box under the bed.)

    Now I will have that song playing in my non-sleeping head all night long!!

    Mk should be run like a business not a popularity contest judge by how much a consultant can order to out do her other unit member.

    Run Like a Business!!! duh.....

    Could you see it know...Donald tells Armarosea if she can beat Pierce, she will win a Kathy VanZeeland Bag. Now you just know it will be done.

  2. Oh, and woman can survive in a man's world, my last career as a corp acct/financial analyst was in a multimillion dollare boiler manufacture. We aren't talking about little boilers. Hospital size to county boilers.
    I know all about CFB and BFB boilers. I have been on top of the 3 story buildings and inside the plants. Hard hat and safety glasses with the steel toed boots.

    Oh, and I am PUBLISHED, dig that any pt readers, I have a published paper with PowerGen.

    Yet I clean up very nicely to conduct my Mary Kay duties! heheh

  3. LookingforAnswersMarch 26, 2008 at 7:08 AM

    Okay...I can only speak for what kind of training that I received from my Director, SSD, ESD and NSD.

    There was NO business training. I mean NONE - no training on accounting, paperwork, inventory, product knowledge (detailed), placing orders (either on paper or online) and GST/PST rebates (not sure if this applies to US – retrieving part of the retail taxes placed on orders when sold at a discount or used for business supplies or personal use).

    Our meetings consist of recognition – ribbons – sales & recruiting queens, how to get booking appointments and mostly how great the company was and why we needed to tell everyone about it.

    Sometimes guests were used in front of the meeting to demonstrate how to do a makeover but most often guests were ushered to another room to have their makeovers done by more experienced consultants. This is where new consultants could go and learn as well (I do like this idea).

    The rest of us would sit and listen to the marketing plan week after week after week into months and years (it’s the same training being done in my area that was done nearly 20 years ago). How we could be in red jackets, cars and directorship and get this much money by a doing $10K production/month which meant numbers...lots of numbers so get out there and get your bookings and hand out the recruiting literature and call your director.

    This kind of training doesn't even happen at CC or Seminar or retreats if your area has those. It's all just motivation (which is great) but it doesn't make you a good business person.

    Nope it’s up to the consultant to figure out all the “real” business training on her own. That is if she still wants to remain a consultant.

    If there was “real” business training it would provide a better supportive base for the new people coming in.

    Yes I know we’re independent contractors, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have the whole picture of how to manage the whole business.

  4. Just thought I should bring a little clarification. This post is not yet "complete". There are some other thoughts that I want to share about this, but I want to hear your reaction to this first.

    Is Mary Kay demonstrating that women CAN survive in a man's world - based on the success of its few that "make it" big?


    Are the excuses so loud and lame and the success stories so few that the overwhelming evidence bends itself towards proving that women CAN'T survive in a man's world?

    The equation is simple.

    Manufactured product - cosmetics and skin care.

    Objective - Sell it.

    Am I oversimplifying?

  5. Lookingforanswers, I am awfully sorry that you have been a part of such a non-training unit. I guess I have been fortunate. I have been a part of two different unit meetings (one my director's, one my adopted directors'). Both did have lots of recognition, but both also offered training. I will say that my adopted directors are better at this; my first director was still somewhat new and not as strong in this area. But both offered training in time management, money management, how to book, how to sell, etc. And my adopted director definitely has a selling unit. I daresay the two are related--she trains in how to run a business and how to sell product, therefore she has a unit that run businesses and sells product!

    I personally find the accounting aspect of the business the most difficult (just not my area of skill), so I have appreciated the training I have received in that area. I made some mistakes early on, but the more I have learned from my directors, the better I have gotten. Now I am much more confident.

    I never pictured myself a businesswoman. I never dreamed of being a business owner when I was a little girl. I studied to be a teacher in college, and taught preschool for several years. But I am becoming a businesswoman, thanks to Mary Kay. I am truly learning how to run a successful business. I won't say that I necessarily run my business the way a man would; I don't know. But it's working, and I'm learning, and I'm happy with my results.

  6. I also get well-rounded training at meetings. My director was a school teacher, but her senior worked for fortune 500 companies and has a business background. Our meetings are combined. The SSD does our training and my director does the SCC for guests. New consultants are told to observe at least 3-5 SCC's before getting the other training.

    We have training on booking, selling, money management, time management, tax prep, etc. I don't feel like they leave anything out.

    I have more on the "woman in a man's world" but that has to wait for now. I'm about to take off.

  7. To answer the post question, can a woman survive in a man's world, absolutely! Can she survive well? (and make equilivant $) Probably not. I think with MK our targeted market serves well to have women selling & teaching SCC and color.

    I don't know that there would be an "equilavent" sales position for mostly men, ie, 'door to door' auto accessories; golf, fishing, hunting or sports equipment sales. Actually the idea of a man doing sales of the above would be close to women selling MK.

    Personally, I still don't believe women are truly treated equal in the workplace. Our little area is still quite backwoods in that men get better pay, etc., even with equal qualifications.

    To the other question re: training as a business, I agree that we are not taught the "business part" of the business.

    I attended the PH Tax workshop this year, took detailed notes & presented them at our meeting. There were more consultants who attended that meeting becaues they were interested in learning the tax workshop info than any other meeting this year.

    Also my DIQ DOES NOT have an agenda for the meetings & when there is a topic, doesn't always stay on the agenda (a BIG PET PEEVE of mine). I get on-line to get booking and additional information, check out other directors websites for ideas, etc. There's a lot you can find!

    I guess I'm just the type I don't like being late, waiting until the last minute, etc. I want an agenda and I want it followed. It just makes good (business) sense to me, plus I think it is considerate of those who attend the meeting if you plan out what you are doing & stick to it!

  8. Oh Puhlease!! Everyone knows that it's Man of Steel, Woman of Tissue Paper. (the lone modern exceptions: Jimmy Carter and Margaret Thatcher).

    I'll go back to my cave now and chew on a mastadon bone.

  9. How about this, compliments of the Muppet Show:


  10. Pyramid schemes like MK don't discriminate between men and women. 99% fail, whether they are men or women. That's the design of these pyramid schemes.

  11. If one tries to run an mlm and focuses on simply recruiting, most will fail. HOWEVER, If you run your Mary Kay as a business and concentrate on selling the product and building a customer base as a retail business and them build your team as you contine to sell our product and buiding your customer base you can be very successful and you can make good money.

    If you try to turn it into a legalized pyramid scheme, you probably are likely to fail.

    Focus on bulding a retail business and great things will happen.

    Now, anon, show me stats where people focused on selling first and recruiting second and I think you will find your 99% figure, (which - I would like to see backup for) would change greatly.

  12. Mary Kay is NOT a pyramid scheme and is very different from most MLM's for many reasons. Two being that there is legitimate product being sold to end user customers and also each consultant buys her product from the company with the intention of selling it to a customer. As MaryKay consultants we do not buy our products from the person who recruited us. That sets us apart from other operations. The people under me do not have to pay me before they can sell a product. In that senario you would have to recruit. With Mary kay if I never recruit anyone I can still get my products at make money.

    As far as the topic, yes a woman can survive in a mans world, but it is still difficult. There is a "good ole boys club" that is still very much alive and well even in 2008

  13. You know, from reading so much that's said on here and other places, not to mention hearing stuff from a few consultants I know really well, the business aspect of MK is nothing to stick your nose up about. That's in support of business-related training. Obviously having a team that receives well-rounded training including areas like accounting is a great thing, but it's also something that can be pursued outside of "MK". For me it's just about to fall into my lap (still haven't decided) as I'm about to finish up my second accounting course and have had a lot of college training that's extremely relevant. I think I'd more go to meetings for the facial side of things. I did think it was really good when I went as a friend's guest for the makeover training. That kind of thing would help me because it's actually the least familiar area for me. Has anyone in MK ever attempted to do real seminars/videos/tapes/books on actual business practices or have they left it all up to the directors/whoever "directs" the team?

  14. mou,

    In our unit, the Directors run the meetings & train at their discretion, usually requesting topics from the consultants on occasion. We can ask the Director to consider specific training or request information & she provides that to us.

    My degree is in business and I was the only IBC who attended the tax workshop. My DIQ asked that I present that information.

    It is my understanding that the Directors are responsible for meetings and topics. So, the trainings depend upon what your Director whats to present/is asked to present.

    I'm not sure if that answers your question or not.


For Further Reading...

This Week On Pink Truth - Click Here
Pros and Cons of Mary Kay - Read or Contribute or Both!
First Post - Why I Started This Blog
The Article I Wrote For ScamTypes.com (here) (there)
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