As you may recall, one of the first incidents in the chain of events that led to me starting this site was the rejection of my apology and subsequent banning from the Pink Truth club.
I was going through some of my files and saw that I had saved the apology in its entirety prior to posting it. In the interest of demonstrating why I believe that I was not out of line, I have decided to post it here.
If you or someone close to you has been burned by someone (singular or plural) in Mary Kay, please accept my apologies.
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Wow...
I am intrigued and troubled that there are so many of you that were hurt by individuals involved in Mary Kay. On behalf of my wife and I am sure countless other consultants, directors, and corporate employees, I am sorry.
Really. I am not trying to convert any of you or tell you that you are wrong. It breaks my heart to hear stories of people being taken advantage of and abused. Please accept my most sincere apology that this happened to you. In addition to that and in support of the creators of this website, if you are feeling pressured to spend money that you don't have, act selfishly in the name of God, or profit from being deceitful, you should indeed run, not walk away from those that promote these practices.
However, the atrocities listed on these pages have not been my experience or of my wife. I have been exposed to and witnessed many MLM and Direct Sales horror stories. So, when my wife expressed interest in MK I was wary. I carefully monitored everything she brought home and challenged all the details of the program. I have been nothing but impressed with the way we have been treated thus far.
We were both raised by loving parents who instilled good values in us and introduced us to a relationship with Jesus. We are both committed Christians. I was a youth pastor for five years and we both have our eyes fixed on doing everything we can to honor God. I have been impressed with the way my wife's Mary Kay business allows her to keep her priorities straight.
The way I see it, and I hope this will help set up an open-minded perspective, Mary Kay is a business. Like any other business, their primary purpose (this is important) is to make money. I don't believe that anywhere in their literature, they claim anything other than that. Anyone will tell you that in order for a business to succeed, it must make money. In order for that to happen, their product or service must be sold. In order for a company to be profitable doing this, the money they make must be more than the money it costs for them to produce and distribute that product or service.
A common rule ratio for the actual cost of a product and the retail price of that same product is 1:4 or 25%. In other words, if you buy an energy drink for $1.00, it probably cost the retailer $.25. This is not exact, it is just a basic rule of thumb used for determining if you can make money selling something.
The problem is that just because you have a product that you can sell at an incredible mark-up doesn't mean that you can make money. You have to find a way to tell people that you have this product and what separates it from the product your competition offers. Enter advertising/marketing.
We are all familiar with advertising because unless you live in a cave, you have seen TV commercials, heard radio ads, seen billboards, read Newspaper ads, and been introduced to products and services in ways that you sometimes don't even realize. Most companies spend the majority of that 75% "profit" on these various forms of advertising. I am sure that most have you have heard about the price of advertising in the Super Bowl ($2.6 million for a 30 second spot! Just ONE!!) The bottom line is that if you want to succeed, you have to find a way to introduce your product to the people that will use it.
Mary Kay, as you all know chooses to invest their "marketing budget" directly into a sales force of (mostly) women who enjoy the product themselves. On the "front end" of the deal, they give you 50% of the profit. You do not have to design the product, create the product, ship the product (unless you have it shipped to you and then in turn ship it to your clients), warehouse the product (unless you choose to build your own inventory), or reimburse your clients for product they were not satisfied with. All you (and I am now using you because it seems that most of you were at one time MK representatives) have to do is demonstrate the product to people that might like it and exchange their money for the product they want (glorified cashier if you will).
In order for this style of marketing to have the same reach as, say, Pepsi, who uses traditional advertising, there has to be a LOT of people offering the product to a LOT of people. This means that naturally the company will reward the members of the sales force who perform well. In our experience, our desire to sell more products (so as to make more money) has always outperformed the expectations of our director. That is not to say that we have not been encouraged to sell more, work harder, etc. but I have never seen this as being any different than my friends encouraging me to train harder (sports) or my parents encouraging me to study harder when I was in school. People get paid to offer this kind of motivation! They are called trainers.
I want to again emphasize that I am not saying that your stories are invalid. Unfortunately, anytime you work with people, you will find that selfishness is inevitable. There are undoubtedly many people in Mary Kay that see a shortcut like pushing their consultants to order more product than they need and take it. There are not strong enough words to describe how horrifically angry it makes me that people claiming to represent the same company my wife represents have done these things to you. To me it is tantamount to the way that people have brutally murdered their fellow man “in the name of God”. (To scale of course)
My wife recently told me that there were several directors (I know not what level) that were dismissed from Mary Kay for doing some of the things that were mentioned on this site (i.e. forcing consultants to place huge inventory orders, taking out loans/credit, etc). They were told that they could never sell Mary Kay again. I applaud and appreciate these actions, and hope that it is evidence of ongoing protection from the corporate level to prevent these sorts of happenings from occurring.
I love my wife strongly, and I know her heart and her character intimately. When she hears no, she stops. When she “compliments” someone, it is sincere. We have both set our course to value people as people, not dollar signs. If we can grow a business through selling cosmetics and skin care products, great! If there are other women or men who would also like to sell these great products, even better. I truly believe that this can be accomplished without manipulating the people around you.
Do I naively suppose that Mary Kay is a perfect organization with no inherent problems? By no means. But I do strongly suggest that you take a look around at any of the major companies doing business in the US and around the world. I think that you will not find many with the integrity and vision of Mary Kay. Does Mary Kay aim to operate their business using Godly principles? I hope so. Do they try to use God to manipulate you to buy makeup? Not the people we’ve met.
We (my wife and I) as well as the people in our small unit try to use Mary Kay as an opportunity to serve God. Not the other way around (Using God as an opportunity to serve Mary Kay). Nonetheless, I can see by your many comments and well written posts, that there are some (if not many) who have gotten it all screwed up and in the process inflicted much damage.
I know that I cannot undo what has been done, but what I can offer you is what I have learned through my personal experiences with abusive treatment. I have learned that the best thing to do when you are wronged is to forgive those that have wronged you. So I again offer my sincere apology for the wrongs that have befallen you and ask you (not for my sake but for yours) please, forgive those people that mistreated you, and find away to sew seeds of life into the people that are around you.
Thank you for your time,
God Bless.
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I know that was pretty long, but if you were able to take it all in, I would love some feedback. Was I out of line? I really did not mean any ill will by it, and to this day am a little put-off by the fact that it was on the basis of this comment that I was rejected by this "friendly community" with absolutely no explanation.
Oh well, C’est la vie
What does everyone else think?
Saturday, October 27, 2007
Wednesday, October 24, 2007
Mary Kay Business Opportunity - Limitless or Scam
The reason that this site exists is because there is a great deal of controversy over the Mary Kay business. A good debate can not be had when only one side of the story is presented. In order to truly evaluate the truth about a matter, one must first here both sides of the story. Hopefully this site will create an environment where that is possible.
The basics of this debate are as follows.
Mary Kay is a cosmetic/skin-care product based company that uses a direct selling marketing plan involving what could be considered dual or multi level marketing. Many sales reps on various levels of the Mary Kay Sales Force claim a great love for the opportunity that has been afforded them through Mary Kay. From personal use consultants that sell to a couple of friends so that they can get a huge discount on their products to business minded individuals that prospect for, find and sell to just about everyone they meet. Like any good business owner, they will most likely recruit others to duplicate their efforts. Mary Kay is structured to allow for commissions to be earned based on the efforts of the people one recruits to their “unit”.
Opponents counter that there is no value to the products offered, there is no way to make money solely by selling product, and that the only people who succeed are the ones that manipulate weak-minded individuals into racking up huge debt to purchase inventory that they will never be able to sell. They also assert that there are no reasons for someone to have a positive outlook on Mary Kay. Reasons cited for optimistic views of Mary Kay include naiveté, manipulation, and the “fake it ‘til you make it” attitude.
Having established that, please weigh in here. If you have had a bad experience with Mary Kay, please describe it here. If you are active in Mary Kay on some level, please describe your experience here. If you are so excited about how great Mary Kay has been for you that you can’t contain yourself, tell the world about it here!
One final note, this is designed to be a place to share personal stories. Please do not attack someone’s experience here. As this site develops, I hope to create a forum where you can go at it in full debate style. But, for now, please simply tell your story! If there are particularly compelling pieces, I will post them on the big page!
If you are not a consultant but want to talk about how much you like or dislike Mary Kay Products, Click Here
The basics of this debate are as follows.
Mary Kay is a cosmetic/skin-care product based company that uses a direct selling marketing plan involving what could be considered dual or multi level marketing. Many sales reps on various levels of the Mary Kay Sales Force claim a great love for the opportunity that has been afforded them through Mary Kay. From personal use consultants that sell to a couple of friends so that they can get a huge discount on their products to business minded individuals that prospect for, find and sell to just about everyone they meet. Like any good business owner, they will most likely recruit others to duplicate their efforts. Mary Kay is structured to allow for commissions to be earned based on the efforts of the people one recruits to their “unit”.
Opponents counter that there is no value to the products offered, there is no way to make money solely by selling product, and that the only people who succeed are the ones that manipulate weak-minded individuals into racking up huge debt to purchase inventory that they will never be able to sell. They also assert that there are no reasons for someone to have a positive outlook on Mary Kay. Reasons cited for optimistic views of Mary Kay include naiveté, manipulation, and the “fake it ‘til you make it” attitude.
Having established that, please weigh in here. If you have had a bad experience with Mary Kay, please describe it here. If you are active in Mary Kay on some level, please describe your experience here. If you are so excited about how great Mary Kay has been for you that you can’t contain yourself, tell the world about it here!
One final note, this is designed to be a place to share personal stories. Please do not attack someone’s experience here. As this site develops, I hope to create a forum where you can go at it in full debate style. But, for now, please simply tell your story! If there are particularly compelling pieces, I will post them on the big page!
If you are not a consultant but want to talk about how much you like or dislike Mary Kay Products, Click Here
Mary Kay Products - Hot or Not
Is this your first time on this site? Do you like Mary Kay Products? Do you think they stink? At the root of the question, “Is Mary Kay a scam?” is the issue of whether or not they have a competitive product to offer.
There are many that swear by how amazing Mary Kay Products are. I have talked to several of them myself. If you are one of the many Mary Kay lovers out there, here is your chance to declare your undying affection to your favorite brand!
On the other hand, there are those that say Mary Kay products are cheaper than the drugstore brands and way more expensive. They posit the theory that the only way anyone sells Mary Kay Products is by “front-loading” new consultants and that there is no way that “real” people would never buy this product. If you are not a fan of Mary Kay, please explain what you don’t like about it here.
Whether you love Mary Kay cosmetics and skin care products, can’t stand them, or are somewhere in the middle, please leave your thoughts here. It might seem obvious to you how good or bad the product is, but for the sake of the inquisitive minds on the internet, let your voice be heard here!
Please note, this post is for comments about the Mary Kay Products ONLY. Please do not talk about your thoughts and feelings about selling, front-loading, scams, conspiracy theories, evil people, hypocrites, or chopping broccoli! If you want to comment on the high’s and low’s of the Mary Kay Business Opportunity, Click Here.
Thanks
There are many that swear by how amazing Mary Kay Products are. I have talked to several of them myself. If you are one of the many Mary Kay lovers out there, here is your chance to declare your undying affection to your favorite brand!
On the other hand, there are those that say Mary Kay products are cheaper than the drugstore brands and way more expensive. They posit the theory that the only way anyone sells Mary Kay Products is by “front-loading” new consultants and that there is no way that “real” people would never buy this product. If you are not a fan of Mary Kay, please explain what you don’t like about it here.
Whether you love Mary Kay cosmetics and skin care products, can’t stand them, or are somewhere in the middle, please leave your thoughts here. It might seem obvious to you how good or bad the product is, but for the sake of the inquisitive minds on the internet, let your voice be heard here!
Please note, this post is for comments about the Mary Kay Products ONLY. Please do not talk about your thoughts and feelings about selling, front-loading, scams, conspiracy theories, evil people, hypocrites, or chopping broccoli! If you want to comment on the high’s and low’s of the Mary Kay Business Opportunity, Click Here.
Thanks
The Good, The Bad – The Ugly, The Pretty
Have something to say about Mary Kay?
If it is about the products, Click Here
If it is about the Business Opportunity, Click Here
If you have something to say that has nothing to do with these two categories, start your own category here! It can be about anything Mary Kay. Anything at all.
Ready Set Go!
If it is about the products, Click Here
If it is about the Business Opportunity, Click Here
If you have something to say that has nothing to do with these two categories, start your own category here! It can be about anything Mary Kay. Anything at all.
Ready Set Go!
Saturday, October 20, 2007
Some thoughts from a friend on ScamTypes - Kim
This post is thanks to Kim who left this comment on ScamTypes.com. You can read all of the comments here. Re-posted with permission.
"Becoming a successful Mary Kay Consultant is an Opportunity. Because humans are involved you are going to find people trying to figure out shortcuts within the opportunity. You are also going to find people who are willing to work hard enough to make it. If you are willing to be smart enough, work hard enough–it can be done. I am a consultant of 14+ years. Do I have a car? No. Am I a director? No. Do I have any recruits? At the present time–no. But I CHOOSE not to work it hard enough to get a car or make thousands. But Mary Kay meets my needs because of how I choose to run my business. I have 3-5 regular customers who order enough so I can order the minimum every 3 months enabling me to have my own cosmetics at 50% off. Better than Wal-mart brands. No where near as expensive as exclusive brands (Clinique, etc.). I can send product back if I don’t like it and exchange it for what I want. I have a 100% money back guarantee. My director calls me to encourage me, not to strong-arm me into selling. Because I have made decisions about what being a consultant means to me, I choose whether to go for her incentive contests, order more, or explain to her my goals (which may not be her goals).The people that decide to buy large amounts of inventory are weak and immature in their business. They want what they want when they want it. They want all new makeup; they want all the pretties; they want to set up their business like senior directors when they don’t have anywhere near the customer base to support it. If you look at the essence of Mary Kay’s philosophy, if you order product then YOU SHOULD EXPECT YOURSELF TO SELL IT. If you don’t intend to sell it, DON’T BUY IT. It’s as simple as that. Strong arming people into becoming your recruits and buying yourself into the production (sales) you need for prizes cannot be maintained. That’s why people fail and get a bad taste their mouths about Mary Kay. There are plenty of consultants out there selling tons of the stuff. And the really successful consultants conduct business, just like any business–they have good quality customer service. They care. They teach They sell. I don’t kid myself about it anymore. And i am not living in a panacea about it either. I made some stupid decisions early on, but I was an immature business woman. I learned and I don’t kid myself about what I will or should sell anymore. I know my capabilities and what becomes an incentive for me to sell and what doesn’t. My sister is a consultant in another state who has 3 recruits and sells a heck a lot more than I do, for no other reason than she opens her mouth more and talks about it more than I do. If you like a product, any product or service, you will talk about it. Successful consultants use the product and are wild about it. You can and must adapt your business practices to your own personality and lifestyle situation. But, whatever changes you make in how the company coaches you when you do it your way, you have to accept the fact that you will either fail miserably or reap the rewards and be willing to make changes accordingly. There is a humorous side to the sarcastic side of dissing anything, but I feel sorry for people who spend so much energy criticizing Mary Kay. Comments by Kate (above) nailed it."
**********************************************************************
I asked Kim if I could post her thoughts here, and her response was as follows
**********************************************************************
"Sure you can post my comments on your website. I will probably visit a couple more times, but I find it very frustrating to debate idiots like Pink Truth because their minds are already CLOSED and LOCKED. I applaud you for getting the word out to those who are considering the business. I will say that I joined Mary Kay in 1992 and went to my very first seminar in 1993. That was the 30th anniversary and one of the last appearances at seminar by Mary Kay. seminar that year, the consultants who had been to seminar before talked about her like a god. I am a very skeptical person (and I joined anyway! what’s to lose?) and couldn’t get into the hero worship. Then I saw her at seminar. WOW! What a personality. Genuine, warm, truly caring, and she was everybody’s biggest cheerleader for succeeding. Now Pink Truth would say something nasty like, “Well, it was all about helping HER bottom line, right?” But, I disagree. She was truly giving women encouragement, self-esteem boosts, and she wanted success for every consultant for what she knew a fulfilling job, and love of what they were doing could provide. Her biography shows that her experience in the man’s world with the glass ceiling gave her perspective and will to succeed. She charged like a bull through all the bull to create a company that could actually provide that. BUT, it doesn’t come free or easy. What business that allows a person to become financially indepedent would?Now I just got the feeling reading a little bit in Pink Truth that all the go-get-em emails that directors send out encouraging you to sell sell sell are a little bit too happy and gushy. Well, I don’t like much gush myself, but since I am a mature individual, I don’t take it personally and it doesn’t make me sick to my stomach–I take it in, digest it for what I need to get out of it and leave the rest. People are enthused and excited about it! And they want to make money but they also want to help other women, who come from all over the place, with all kinds of strengths, experiences, and baggage to “get it.” I would much rather be around the gushing than the toxic “stuff” coming from Pink Truth. They just don’t “get it” and its eating them up inside."
**************************************************************************
I wanted to send this message loud and clear. There are many different ways that you can get a lot of enjoyment out of Mary Kay. It is a good or bad experience based on what you make of it. Pink Truth unfortunately makes it out to be all bad. Mary Kay tends to make it out to be all good. Somewhere in the middle is the truth, and I invite you to find out what that truth is. Just be sure to use good common sense!!!
Thanks Kim! Hope to see you and your friends/clients around here!
"Becoming a successful Mary Kay Consultant is an Opportunity. Because humans are involved you are going to find people trying to figure out shortcuts within the opportunity. You are also going to find people who are willing to work hard enough to make it. If you are willing to be smart enough, work hard enough–it can be done. I am a consultant of 14+ years. Do I have a car? No. Am I a director? No. Do I have any recruits? At the present time–no. But I CHOOSE not to work it hard enough to get a car or make thousands. But Mary Kay meets my needs because of how I choose to run my business. I have 3-5 regular customers who order enough so I can order the minimum every 3 months enabling me to have my own cosmetics at 50% off. Better than Wal-mart brands. No where near as expensive as exclusive brands (Clinique, etc.). I can send product back if I don’t like it and exchange it for what I want. I have a 100% money back guarantee. My director calls me to encourage me, not to strong-arm me into selling. Because I have made decisions about what being a consultant means to me, I choose whether to go for her incentive contests, order more, or explain to her my goals (which may not be her goals).The people that decide to buy large amounts of inventory are weak and immature in their business. They want what they want when they want it. They want all new makeup; they want all the pretties; they want to set up their business like senior directors when they don’t have anywhere near the customer base to support it. If you look at the essence of Mary Kay’s philosophy, if you order product then YOU SHOULD EXPECT YOURSELF TO SELL IT. If you don’t intend to sell it, DON’T BUY IT. It’s as simple as that. Strong arming people into becoming your recruits and buying yourself into the production (sales) you need for prizes cannot be maintained. That’s why people fail and get a bad taste their mouths about Mary Kay. There are plenty of consultants out there selling tons of the stuff. And the really successful consultants conduct business, just like any business–they have good quality customer service. They care. They teach They sell. I don’t kid myself about it anymore. And i am not living in a panacea about it either. I made some stupid decisions early on, but I was an immature business woman. I learned and I don’t kid myself about what I will or should sell anymore. I know my capabilities and what becomes an incentive for me to sell and what doesn’t. My sister is a consultant in another state who has 3 recruits and sells a heck a lot more than I do, for no other reason than she opens her mouth more and talks about it more than I do. If you like a product, any product or service, you will talk about it. Successful consultants use the product and are wild about it. You can and must adapt your business practices to your own personality and lifestyle situation. But, whatever changes you make in how the company coaches you when you do it your way, you have to accept the fact that you will either fail miserably or reap the rewards and be willing to make changes accordingly. There is a humorous side to the sarcastic side of dissing anything, but I feel sorry for people who spend so much energy criticizing Mary Kay. Comments by Kate (above) nailed it."
**********************************************************************
I asked Kim if I could post her thoughts here, and her response was as follows
**********************************************************************
"Sure you can post my comments on your website. I will probably visit a couple more times, but I find it very frustrating to debate idiots like Pink Truth because their minds are already CLOSED and LOCKED. I applaud you for getting the word out to those who are considering the business. I will say that I joined Mary Kay in 1992 and went to my very first seminar in 1993. That was the 30th anniversary and one of the last appearances at seminar by Mary Kay. seminar that year, the consultants who had been to seminar before talked about her like a god. I am a very skeptical person (and I joined anyway! what’s to lose?) and couldn’t get into the hero worship. Then I saw her at seminar. WOW! What a personality. Genuine, warm, truly caring, and she was everybody’s biggest cheerleader for succeeding. Now Pink Truth would say something nasty like, “Well, it was all about helping HER bottom line, right?” But, I disagree. She was truly giving women encouragement, self-esteem boosts, and she wanted success for every consultant for what she knew a fulfilling job, and love of what they were doing could provide. Her biography shows that her experience in the man’s world with the glass ceiling gave her perspective and will to succeed. She charged like a bull through all the bull to create a company that could actually provide that. BUT, it doesn’t come free or easy. What business that allows a person to become financially indepedent would?Now I just got the feeling reading a little bit in Pink Truth that all the go-get-em emails that directors send out encouraging you to sell sell sell are a little bit too happy and gushy. Well, I don’t like much gush myself, but since I am a mature individual, I don’t take it personally and it doesn’t make me sick to my stomach–I take it in, digest it for what I need to get out of it and leave the rest. People are enthused and excited about it! And they want to make money but they also want to help other women, who come from all over the place, with all kinds of strengths, experiences, and baggage to “get it.” I would much rather be around the gushing than the toxic “stuff” coming from Pink Truth. They just don’t “get it” and its eating them up inside."
**************************************************************************
I wanted to send this message loud and clear. There are many different ways that you can get a lot of enjoyment out of Mary Kay. It is a good or bad experience based on what you make of it. Pink Truth unfortunately makes it out to be all bad. Mary Kay tends to make it out to be all good. Somewhere in the middle is the truth, and I invite you to find out what that truth is. Just be sure to use good common sense!!!
Thanks Kim! Hope to see you and your friends/clients around here!
My Guest Post On ScamTypes.com!
I was recently given the opportunity to post my feelings about my wife's experience with Mary Kay and my opinions about whether or not it is a good opportunity. I have reposted it here because I think it goes a long way to explain what this site is all about!
Enjoi
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First of all, I would like to thank my good friend Scam for this opportunity to present to all of you, his faithful readers, what I hope will be a balanced view of the Mary Kay opportunity. My motivation for submitting this article is simple. My wife is a Mary Kay Independent Beauty Consultant. I have experienced great joy seeing the level of enthusiasm and excitement she has for her role in spreading the delightful Mary Kay experience to others. Realizing that there are both valid and invalid criticisms of this company that my wife so greatly loves, I felt it appropriate for me to create a place where the pros and cons could be seen in one place. That place is here. I feel honored to be given the opportunity to explain myself and the site I started. What follows is (hopefully) a balanced view of the Mary Kay Opportunity.
Mary Kay (for those of you that have never heard of it) is a company that produces and distributes cosmetic and skin care products. These products are competitive in their own right. Although some may disagree with this assertion, I am quite confident that these products can hold their own among their competitors. Why? Two reasons. First, real people like it. Second, numbers don’t lie. Mary Kay’s products are at least equal to (if not better than) anything else that you can get your hands on for a similar price.
Real people like it?! Yes, they do. My boss is a perfect example. My boss is an incredible woman. She is the CEO of our company which is a small marketing/advertising agency in Los Angeles. She is sensible in every sense of the word, has run a successful business for over ten years and (like Scam) does not LOVE the concept of Multi-level Marketing (more about that later). However, as a professional women, she has concluded (and confided in me, apart from our ‘work’ relationship) that Mary Kay is the best product she has ever used. She is one, among many, of the women that my wife provides these cosmetics and skin care products to. They all love these products.
Numbers don’t lie? Here is an interesting subject that I won’t spend an inordinate amount of time on. Mary Kay takes great pride in offering high quality products to their sales force, and ultimately to their end consumer. I won’t get into the details of the numbers that Mary Kay puts up on their website. Check it out here. The bottom line is that I have seen first hand the factory where they produce their products (in Texas) and I have seen what comes in the mail that my wife sends to her clients, and these are real products that real people use.
If there is one thing that I have learned so far in life, it is that it really does not matter what you have to offer, if you cannot get it in front of the people that could benefit from it, you might as well go home, because you have nothing. There are two primary ways to promote your product/service. The one that we are all familiar with is advertising (and PR). You pick your audience and pay the price to reach them with your message. For a national (or international) campaign, a cosmetics/skin care company WILL spend millions or more likely billions of dollars on ads and PR. The other method of promoting your product is this (not so) new method known as multi-level marketing. Rather than paying out BIG bucks to an Ad Agency and TV/Radio Stations for non-guaranteed results, MLM’s drop (almost) all of that cash on their high earners, in the anticipation of getting a better ROI (Return on investment)
The biggest contention against/for Mary Kay (or any MLM) lies in this question. Traditional Advertising or Direct Marketing? Both points of view have equally strong arguments and as such, it is really a preference thing. If you prefer to plow your own trail, sign up for an MLM. Going this route affords you the possibility of really big payoffs. If you prefer traditional advertising, and people coming to you already wanting to buy your product, get involved with one of the many companies that put their money there. The trade-off is obvious. When YOU generate interest in the product, you make more money. When someone else generates the interest, you make less money. My wife REALLY loves Mary Kay, and generates a lot of enthusiasm in the people around her for this product. I fall more into the latter category. Send people to me, and I will help them out. I don’t mind making “less money” as long as I don’t have to persuade people of anything. One is not better than the other. You must do what is best for you.
The benefits of being involved in a company like Mary Kay (as far as I can tell) are many! There is big money to be made if you are aggressive, and make it into the upper echelon. Cosmetics/Skin Care is a big industry, count on regular re-orders and clients that trust you, love you, and often become good friends. If you run your business with integrity, stick to your values, and treat everyone around you with the respect they deserve and you would like to be treated with, you will deepen the relationships you have and earn the trust of a strong client base.
On the relationship front, there are many opportunities to be had. First, my wife has met many wonderful women in her unit. In addition, many of the people that she meets through appointments and referrals have become close friends and excellent contacts. If you like people, this gives you a great “excuse” to get together and talk about something you both have in common. I don’t get it personally (because I am a guy I guess) but my wife and her new friends will spend hours talking skin care, and they are both (or all) so happy when they are done!
The negatives of this sort of thing can almost be worse than the positives. I must preface this section by stating that while what follows is a sad and unfortunate truth, it is even sadder that most of the negatives could be prevented with a little common sense. As with any good thing, unscrupulous people have taken a good thing and twisted it into a mortifying sordid “version” of the original, and sailing under the once spotless name of that thing have led many astray and into a trap. This defiling of the pure concept is carried on as those that were manipulated attempt to dig themselves out by manipulating others. This vicious cycle, unfortunately, perpetuates itself.
Some of the warning signs that you should look out for are lies, manipulation, and debt. If you have to lie to your spouse, friends/family, clients, potential recruits, or (especially) yourself, you are inviting trouble. DON’T even get started. If you have started, get out. Deception will never pay off. It will come around full circle and hurt you and the ones you love. Similarly, if you are manipulating (or using any ‘sneaky’ tactics) to “get your way”, you will end up regretting it, get out while you can. Don’t use the fact that you feel that you were “manipulated in” as an excuse, you made a mistake, get over it and get out. Manipulation and Lies are no basis to start any endeavor with. Don’t do it.
Debt is a unique problem. Many people borrow money to start an entrepreneurial endeavor. So when is it balanced and healthy, and when is it insane? That depends on you. I recommend that you consider the following as a guide. Any venture is going to require an initial investment. Decide what you are willing to risk and what you are willing to risk it in exchange for. In other words, “I am willing to risk $100 in exchange for the possibility of making $1,000/month in 2 years” OR “I am willing to risk $1,000 up front in exchange for the possibility of making $6,000/month in 5 years”. If you invest the money, and the payoff doesn’t come in the time that you realistically set for yourself, chalk it up as a loss and move on. It baffles my mind to hear of people that CONTINUE throwing money at something that is obviously not working for them. I have started several endeavors that failed miserably. I weighed the risk, and when I lost, I knew that I was not in over my head. It was calculated BEFORE I invested in it. You should never get into debt that you can not get yourself out of in the event of failure. This is like going to Vegas with a loan for as much as you could get from you bank, dropping it all onto one table and making a bet. If you lose… well you get the idea.
Mary Kay may be the greatest thing you have ever done. My wife is a stellar example. She loves it. She has maintained her integrity and values throughout her experience. She has started to make enough money to SIGNIFICANTLY help with our finances. If you are interested in finding out more about Mary Kay Products or being a Mary Kay Independent Beauty Consultant, Click Here for my wife’s website and to get in touch with her!
Mary Kay may not be right for you. If this is not a fit for you (and you may not find out until you are into it) you will be miserable. If you are not sure, and have an extra $120 laying around, give it a try. If you are involved, and have decided it is not for you, don’t throw more money at the problem. An alcoholic does not recover by drinking away his problem! Get out. You can return the product you bought at 90% of what you paid for it. Or you can just sell it at its retail value. If you have space to hang onto what you have, I say why not? Who cares if it takes you ten years to sell it all? Just stop spending money on stuff you don’t need!
I hope that I have presented a balanced view here. Mary Kay is obviously not a scam in and of itself. However, beware that there are unscrupulous representatives out there that may try to scam you in any of several different ways. These people give the “good MK reps” like my wife a bad name. Mary Kay (like ALL MLM’s) is something that should be approached with great caution. It could be the greatest joy or greatest frustration of your life. But, if you use COMMON SENSE as your guide, and don’t get in over your head, you have nothing to worry about. Check it out for yourself.
If you have something to say about this topic you have many options:
If you are strictly Anti-Mary Kay – visit Pink Truth
If you are Pro-Mary Kay or neutral/balanced – visit The Truth About Mary Kay
If you don’t feel like going anywhere else, OR could care less about Mary Kay, OR have a crush on our good friend Scam – leave a comment here!
If you want more information about Mary Kay, please visit my wife’s site, and contact her there.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please have a peek around the site, leave a comment if you like what you see (or if you don't)! If you want to read some other great reports about whether certain things are scams or good business opportunities check out ScamTypes.com
Thanks
Enjoi
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First of all, I would like to thank my good friend Scam for this opportunity to present to all of you, his faithful readers, what I hope will be a balanced view of the Mary Kay opportunity. My motivation for submitting this article is simple. My wife is a Mary Kay Independent Beauty Consultant. I have experienced great joy seeing the level of enthusiasm and excitement she has for her role in spreading the delightful Mary Kay experience to others. Realizing that there are both valid and invalid criticisms of this company that my wife so greatly loves, I felt it appropriate for me to create a place where the pros and cons could be seen in one place. That place is here. I feel honored to be given the opportunity to explain myself and the site I started. What follows is (hopefully) a balanced view of the Mary Kay Opportunity.
Mary Kay (for those of you that have never heard of it) is a company that produces and distributes cosmetic and skin care products. These products are competitive in their own right. Although some may disagree with this assertion, I am quite confident that these products can hold their own among their competitors. Why? Two reasons. First, real people like it. Second, numbers don’t lie. Mary Kay’s products are at least equal to (if not better than) anything else that you can get your hands on for a similar price.
Real people like it?! Yes, they do. My boss is a perfect example. My boss is an incredible woman. She is the CEO of our company which is a small marketing/advertising agency in Los Angeles. She is sensible in every sense of the word, has run a successful business for over ten years and (like Scam) does not LOVE the concept of Multi-level Marketing (more about that later). However, as a professional women, she has concluded (and confided in me, apart from our ‘work’ relationship) that Mary Kay is the best product she has ever used. She is one, among many, of the women that my wife provides these cosmetics and skin care products to. They all love these products.
Numbers don’t lie? Here is an interesting subject that I won’t spend an inordinate amount of time on. Mary Kay takes great pride in offering high quality products to their sales force, and ultimately to their end consumer. I won’t get into the details of the numbers that Mary Kay puts up on their website. Check it out here. The bottom line is that I have seen first hand the factory where they produce their products (in Texas) and I have seen what comes in the mail that my wife sends to her clients, and these are real products that real people use.
If there is one thing that I have learned so far in life, it is that it really does not matter what you have to offer, if you cannot get it in front of the people that could benefit from it, you might as well go home, because you have nothing. There are two primary ways to promote your product/service. The one that we are all familiar with is advertising (and PR). You pick your audience and pay the price to reach them with your message. For a national (or international) campaign, a cosmetics/skin care company WILL spend millions or more likely billions of dollars on ads and PR. The other method of promoting your product is this (not so) new method known as multi-level marketing. Rather than paying out BIG bucks to an Ad Agency and TV/Radio Stations for non-guaranteed results, MLM’s drop (almost) all of that cash on their high earners, in the anticipation of getting a better ROI (Return on investment)
The biggest contention against/for Mary Kay (or any MLM) lies in this question. Traditional Advertising or Direct Marketing? Both points of view have equally strong arguments and as such, it is really a preference thing. If you prefer to plow your own trail, sign up for an MLM. Going this route affords you the possibility of really big payoffs. If you prefer traditional advertising, and people coming to you already wanting to buy your product, get involved with one of the many companies that put their money there. The trade-off is obvious. When YOU generate interest in the product, you make more money. When someone else generates the interest, you make less money. My wife REALLY loves Mary Kay, and generates a lot of enthusiasm in the people around her for this product. I fall more into the latter category. Send people to me, and I will help them out. I don’t mind making “less money” as long as I don’t have to persuade people of anything. One is not better than the other. You must do what is best for you.
The benefits of being involved in a company like Mary Kay (as far as I can tell) are many! There is big money to be made if you are aggressive, and make it into the upper echelon. Cosmetics/Skin Care is a big industry, count on regular re-orders and clients that trust you, love you, and often become good friends. If you run your business with integrity, stick to your values, and treat everyone around you with the respect they deserve and you would like to be treated with, you will deepen the relationships you have and earn the trust of a strong client base.
On the relationship front, there are many opportunities to be had. First, my wife has met many wonderful women in her unit. In addition, many of the people that she meets through appointments and referrals have become close friends and excellent contacts. If you like people, this gives you a great “excuse” to get together and talk about something you both have in common. I don’t get it personally (because I am a guy I guess) but my wife and her new friends will spend hours talking skin care, and they are both (or all) so happy when they are done!
The negatives of this sort of thing can almost be worse than the positives. I must preface this section by stating that while what follows is a sad and unfortunate truth, it is even sadder that most of the negatives could be prevented with a little common sense. As with any good thing, unscrupulous people have taken a good thing and twisted it into a mortifying sordid “version” of the original, and sailing under the once spotless name of that thing have led many astray and into a trap. This defiling of the pure concept is carried on as those that were manipulated attempt to dig themselves out by manipulating others. This vicious cycle, unfortunately, perpetuates itself.
Some of the warning signs that you should look out for are lies, manipulation, and debt. If you have to lie to your spouse, friends/family, clients, potential recruits, or (especially) yourself, you are inviting trouble. DON’T even get started. If you have started, get out. Deception will never pay off. It will come around full circle and hurt you and the ones you love. Similarly, if you are manipulating (or using any ‘sneaky’ tactics) to “get your way”, you will end up regretting it, get out while you can. Don’t use the fact that you feel that you were “manipulated in” as an excuse, you made a mistake, get over it and get out. Manipulation and Lies are no basis to start any endeavor with. Don’t do it.
Debt is a unique problem. Many people borrow money to start an entrepreneurial endeavor. So when is it balanced and healthy, and when is it insane? That depends on you. I recommend that you consider the following as a guide. Any venture is going to require an initial investment. Decide what you are willing to risk and what you are willing to risk it in exchange for. In other words, “I am willing to risk $100 in exchange for the possibility of making $1,000/month in 2 years” OR “I am willing to risk $1,000 up front in exchange for the possibility of making $6,000/month in 5 years”. If you invest the money, and the payoff doesn’t come in the time that you realistically set for yourself, chalk it up as a loss and move on. It baffles my mind to hear of people that CONTINUE throwing money at something that is obviously not working for them. I have started several endeavors that failed miserably. I weighed the risk, and when I lost, I knew that I was not in over my head. It was calculated BEFORE I invested in it. You should never get into debt that you can not get yourself out of in the event of failure. This is like going to Vegas with a loan for as much as you could get from you bank, dropping it all onto one table and making a bet. If you lose… well you get the idea.
Mary Kay may be the greatest thing you have ever done. My wife is a stellar example. She loves it. She has maintained her integrity and values throughout her experience. She has started to make enough money to SIGNIFICANTLY help with our finances. If you are interested in finding out more about Mary Kay Products or being a Mary Kay Independent Beauty Consultant, Click Here for my wife’s website and to get in touch with her!
Mary Kay may not be right for you. If this is not a fit for you (and you may not find out until you are into it) you will be miserable. If you are not sure, and have an extra $120 laying around, give it a try. If you are involved, and have decided it is not for you, don’t throw more money at the problem. An alcoholic does not recover by drinking away his problem! Get out. You can return the product you bought at 90% of what you paid for it. Or you can just sell it at its retail value. If you have space to hang onto what you have, I say why not? Who cares if it takes you ten years to sell it all? Just stop spending money on stuff you don’t need!
I hope that I have presented a balanced view here. Mary Kay is obviously not a scam in and of itself. However, beware that there are unscrupulous representatives out there that may try to scam you in any of several different ways. These people give the “good MK reps” like my wife a bad name. Mary Kay (like ALL MLM’s) is something that should be approached with great caution. It could be the greatest joy or greatest frustration of your life. But, if you use COMMON SENSE as your guide, and don’t get in over your head, you have nothing to worry about. Check it out for yourself.
If you have something to say about this topic you have many options:
If you are strictly Anti-Mary Kay – visit Pink Truth
If you are Pro-Mary Kay or neutral/balanced – visit The Truth About Mary Kay
If you don’t feel like going anywhere else, OR could care less about Mary Kay, OR have a crush on our good friend Scam – leave a comment here!
If you want more information about Mary Kay, please visit my wife’s site, and contact her there.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please have a peek around the site, leave a comment if you like what you see (or if you don't)! If you want to read some other great reports about whether certain things are scams or good business opportunities check out ScamTypes.com
Thanks
Saturday, October 6, 2007
Sweet Irony from Pink Truth
In an attempt to be humorous, Pink Truth has posted some of those de-motivational posters that we have all seen. Check it out!
Is it possible that ironically, these posters give us a glimpse into the reason that Pink Truthers didn’t fare so well in the Mary Kay world? Lets examine, shall we?
"If we don’t take care of the customer, maybe they’ll stop bugging us."
I have seen this attitude from some of the commentators on Pink Truth. They act as though working with people and helping people is a foreign concept.
"Dreams are like rainbows. Only idiots chase them."
There is nothing wrong with chasing dreams… maintaining healthy perspective of course. It seems that Pink Truth has decided that since they didn’t catch their dreams when they chased them, that no-one should!
And finally,
"Quitters never win, winners never quit, but those who never win and never quit are idiots."
This one could have been inspired by the endless tripe being shoveled at Pink Truth. If you are happy with your Mary Kay career or if you are pressing in to it hoping to one day achieve something worthwhile, these PTer’s will think you are an idiot.
This is a great example of something that I have observed on Pink Truth. For everything they speak out against Mary Kay, you can find the equivalent on their site. More about this later, but some examples include:
Mind numbing brainwashing – Pink Truth only allows comment that share their point of view
Shameless moneymaking schemes – Pink Truth has advertising and believe it or not, product sales of hokey, valueless nonsense.
As I said, more later.
Thanks everyone.
Is it possible that ironically, these posters give us a glimpse into the reason that Pink Truthers didn’t fare so well in the Mary Kay world? Lets examine, shall we?
"If we don’t take care of the customer, maybe they’ll stop bugging us."
I have seen this attitude from some of the commentators on Pink Truth. They act as though working with people and helping people is a foreign concept.
"Dreams are like rainbows. Only idiots chase them."
There is nothing wrong with chasing dreams… maintaining healthy perspective of course. It seems that Pink Truth has decided that since they didn’t catch their dreams when they chased them, that no-one should!
And finally,
"Quitters never win, winners never quit, but those who never win and never quit are idiots."
This one could have been inspired by the endless tripe being shoveled at Pink Truth. If you are happy with your Mary Kay career or if you are pressing in to it hoping to one day achieve something worthwhile, these PTer’s will think you are an idiot.
This is a great example of something that I have observed on Pink Truth. For everything they speak out against Mary Kay, you can find the equivalent on their site. More about this later, but some examples include:
Mind numbing brainwashing – Pink Truth only allows comment that share their point of view
Shameless moneymaking schemes – Pink Truth has advertising and believe it or not, product sales of hokey, valueless nonsense.
As I said, more later.
Thanks everyone.
Warm Chatting or Warm Stalking? The Solicitation Conundrum.
So, now you are a Mary Kay Independent Beauty Consultant! Congratulations! Now you have to find people to buy those cosmetics and skin care products that you have signed up to sell. Mary Kay has created a great way to help you solicit customers. While you are out doing the things you do on a daily basis, keep your eyes open for women that you might get along with. Start a conversation with them. Tell them you sell Mary Kay and would love to give them a free demonstration of how great Mary Kay is. If they are interested, get their information and set up a time and place (your place or theirs) to get together. This can be done on the spot or later over the phone or via email depending on their time constraint. Make sure you get their phone number because it is unlikely that they will prioritize this high enough to actually call you. You will have to call them. Mary Kay calls this Warm Chatting.
Pink Truth, the ever constructive, enthusiastic, optimists have relabeled this practice as Warm Stalking. As near as I can tell, this is because when they participated in this practice they resorted to insincere compliments and other unsavory practices in hopes of procuring the leads that they needed to give their new business the kick it needed. It seems that some of them saw success with this while others did not. In either scenario, a painfully obvious resentment to this process developed. They now posit the theory that all Mary Kay IBC’s are as sneaky and deceptive as they tried to be, just better at it.
So Mary Kay inc says that warm chatter is “A” good way to solicit potential customers. Pink Truth says that this is a mortifying example of the “torture” that Mary Kay puts its IBC’s through. Which one is it? Is Mary Kay an evil empire, forcing its minions to do its bidding? Or, has Mary Kay simply provide a convenient, simple way for its independent contractors to succeed in their new business? Let’s explore.
Pros:
1. This is a really simple and non threatening way for you to introduce yourself to possible customers. If they are not interested you have not lost a thing. If they are interested, you have a new customer and possibly a new recruit. (You never know!)
2. You do this during your NORMAL day-to-day so it is neither an inconvenience or an additional time crunch.
3. If they are not interested, perhaps you have made a new friend or acquaintance.
Cons:
1. If you are not genuine people see right through this technique.
2. If you are ingenuine, people reject you and you begin to resent yourself and in turn, the process. If you take this rejection personal, you can only handle it for so long.
3. The more you allow this rejection and resentment to build, the more acutely you will feel it. Before long, you will naturally build such an opposition to it that you will create scenarios in your mind where anyone involved with Mary Kay is evil.
Is this approach to approaching customers better labeled “Warm Chatting” or Warm Stalking”?
If you are a new or not-so-new consultant, let me strongly caution you to be genuine and sincere. If you are not, you will most likely burn yourself. And that’s never worth it. If you can’t be yourself and approach women at the same time, you probably should find another career path. If you can do this without compromising who you are you should do great! If you are not already a Mary Kay Girl, click here to see my wife’s site and learn how to get started!
Thanks everyone.
Scroll down for a personal note to Pink Truth-bots :)
If you are one of the bitter ex-MK IBC’s that I have described above, the following is for you…
The mere fact that YOU were insincere when approaching someone demonstrates that you did not understand what it was all about. This is a people business, and if you can’t treat people right, you will not succeed. However, this does not mean that the people succeeding are using your tricks and schemes. In fact, most likely, if they are doing well, it is because they are NOT acting this way. Stop accusing people of doing things that you did. Not everyone is as unscrupulous as you.
It is a long story
Pink Truth, the ever constructive, enthusiastic, optimists have relabeled this practice as Warm Stalking. As near as I can tell, this is because when they participated in this practice they resorted to insincere compliments and other unsavory practices in hopes of procuring the leads that they needed to give their new business the kick it needed. It seems that some of them saw success with this while others did not. In either scenario, a painfully obvious resentment to this process developed. They now posit the theory that all Mary Kay IBC’s are as sneaky and deceptive as they tried to be, just better at it.
So Mary Kay inc says that warm chatter is “A” good way to solicit potential customers. Pink Truth says that this is a mortifying example of the “torture” that Mary Kay puts its IBC’s through. Which one is it? Is Mary Kay an evil empire, forcing its minions to do its bidding? Or, has Mary Kay simply provide a convenient, simple way for its independent contractors to succeed in their new business? Let’s explore.
Pros:
1. This is a really simple and non threatening way for you to introduce yourself to possible customers. If they are not interested you have not lost a thing. If they are interested, you have a new customer and possibly a new recruit. (You never know!)
2. You do this during your NORMAL day-to-day so it is neither an inconvenience or an additional time crunch.
3. If they are not interested, perhaps you have made a new friend or acquaintance.
Cons:
1. If you are not genuine people see right through this technique.
2. If you are ingenuine, people reject you and you begin to resent yourself and in turn, the process. If you take this rejection personal, you can only handle it for so long.
3. The more you allow this rejection and resentment to build, the more acutely you will feel it. Before long, you will naturally build such an opposition to it that you will create scenarios in your mind where anyone involved with Mary Kay is evil.
Is this approach to approaching customers better labeled “Warm Chatting” or Warm Stalking”?
If you are a new or not-so-new consultant, let me strongly caution you to be genuine and sincere. If you are not, you will most likely burn yourself. And that’s never worth it. If you can’t be yourself and approach women at the same time, you probably should find another career path. If you can do this without compromising who you are you should do great! If you are not already a Mary Kay Girl, click here to see my wife’s site and learn how to get started!
Thanks everyone.
Scroll down for a personal note to Pink Truth-bots :)
If you are one of the bitter ex-MK IBC’s that I have described above, the following is for you…
The mere fact that YOU were insincere when approaching someone demonstrates that you did not understand what it was all about. This is a people business, and if you can’t treat people right, you will not succeed. However, this does not mean that the people succeeding are using your tricks and schemes. In fact, most likely, if they are doing well, it is because they are NOT acting this way. Stop accusing people of doing things that you did. Not everyone is as unscrupulous as you.
It is a long story
Why am I so harsh towards the comments found on Pink Truth?
I will take time to explain this later, but mainly:
1 They constantly crack on all things Mary Kay, half the time using half-truths and flat out lies that are far worse than the ones they are accusing Mary Kay of telling.
2 I tried to reach out to them. I left a comment on their site apologizing on behalf of all the good consultants and directors that would never allow these abuses to go on. My comments were deleted and I was barred from their site. When I have time, I will repost my apology letter here.
3 Because my wife and the organization she represents are being attacked, I feel the need to support her in equal measure. Take pot-shots at my wife and her friends, you better believe I am going to return fire.
Thats all for now... more later
Thanks everyone
1 They constantly crack on all things Mary Kay, half the time using half-truths and flat out lies that are far worse than the ones they are accusing Mary Kay of telling.
2 I tried to reach out to them. I left a comment on their site apologizing on behalf of all the good consultants and directors that would never allow these abuses to go on. My comments were deleted and I was barred from their site. When I have time, I will repost my apology letter here.
3 Because my wife and the organization she represents are being attacked, I feel the need to support her in equal measure. Take pot-shots at my wife and her friends, you better believe I am going to return fire.
Thats all for now... more later
Thanks everyone
Friday, October 5, 2007
Two Ridiculous posts from Pink Truth for October 5
Two posts coming out of the Pink Truth camp tonight.
A story about how much money you can potentially lose in Mary Kay.
and
An accusatory evaluation of a Mary Kay Event.
Click on the picture to see full size.
Tonight I will focus on the latter.
I have been to many seminars and events in many different settings. It is almost always a given that the event organizer is going to make some money (often very good money). This particular event, and many like it, does not seem overpriced for what you are getting in exchange. For instance, Sean Key, the Vice President of Sales Development for all of Mary Kay is a very charismatic individual that is both entertaining and motivational. I am not sure what kind of price tag a guy like that fetches for a speaking engagement, but he is certainly a value add.
So we come to it. A sales representative for Mary Kay reaches a significant milestone in her career. National Sales Director takes a lot of hard work and focused determination. She naturally sets up an event to celebrate this accomplishment with all the people that helped her get there. Instead of just getting these people together for snacks and punch, she decides to bring some folks to the event that will help train, inform, and motivate the guests that she has invited.
All of this takes a lot of effort and costs a lot of money. Most event coordinators that I have talked to expect to make between $20k and $50k for a single event. That is the coordinator, not the person financing the event. Now this particular event may be considerably smaller than the ones my friends have put together but nonetheless, if she made money in the process of helping other women get excited about their careers, what is wrong with that?
Regarding the math on this post. (again, click the picture below to see it full size, or click here)
Lets just use the 500 people scenario. At full price -$110.00 you have $55,000! I know, I know that is a big number! How could a person take ALL THAT MONEY and not be an evil monster? Lets look at some of the expenses that are going to eat up that money. I will try to stay low on my estimates here to add to the possibility of lending credence to this MASSIVE rip off that Pink Truth is decrying.
$55,000 Income
- $2,000 Meeting space ($1,000/day)
- $20,000 Food – ($10/person/meal) 500 people, 2 meals (dinner/luncheon) – $10,000 if we assume meals are $5/person –unlikely
- $3,000 Guest Speakers – This is assuming that you can get these guys to come speak at an event for $1,000 dollars. That barely covers airfare, hotel and food so they would basically be doing this as a favor for this debuting NSD (if that is the case)
- $4,000 Labor – Assuming that all the processing of paperwork, mailings, phone work, reservations, set up of sound systems, worship team, coordinating guest speakers, and everything else is this “cheap”
Grand Total for Event - $29,000 leaving $26,000 dollars for this NSD who probably put enough effort into this to earn that figure.
More likely, the numbers will be something like
- $5,000 Meeting space
- $30,000 Food
- $9,000 Guest Speakers
- $6,000 Labor
Leaving $5,000 for the new NSD who has probably invested a considerable amount of her personal time in this project.
Which number is accurate? I can’t say, but what I can say is that:
It probably wasn’t quite the “pretty nice paycheck when all is said and done” picture that Tracy painted for this post.
Even if she did MAKE $50,ooo by putting this together, there is nothing wrong with that. Maybe you should put together an event like this. Its done all the time. They are called SEMINARS. Some can cost upwards of $1,200 per person – and they don’t feed you at those!
Some comments:
steph53282 said:
It's $110 plus lodging? Seriously? You are paying for one dinner and one lunch...that's it. I am appalled. Another $129 for lodging. You are paying for her to have a party about herself. She needs to pay for everything. Guests will be free I'm sure. Plus her directors will have to get her a gift, that is so expensive. How much does it cost for NSD's and special guests to come to a debut and speak. Doesn't GMB and PS always do debuts?
This is the epitome of lame, whiny, excuse making crybabies that inspired me to create this site…. “she needs to pay for everything”???? What kind of twisted attitude is that? Someone goes out of her way to include you in an event that could help you improve yourself, enjoy yourself, and have fun with others, and you say “she needs to pay for everything”????? This makes me sick!!! She achieved something that you didn’t, so SHE should PAY for YOU???? Outrageous!! This should be a time of celebration and anticipation of growth. Pony Up. If you don’t have the dough, stay home. No one is saying you have to go! For that matter, this wasn’t even sent to you. It was designed for someone else. You are appalled? I am appalled!!!!
Theory said:
1)…”Employees are reimbursed in full for all food, and pay for their lodging on an agency credit card for work travel. 100% free for them.”
2)…. “The bottom line is, no legitimate company would dare to charge employees for work related travel, food or lodging.”
3) …. “Thank God my sister in law is out of this cult and awaiting her refund. MKC in no way even resembles a real business!”
EMPLOYEES are reimbursed… First of all your talking about employees being REQUIRED to go to an event. OF COURSE they don’t pay a dime. Welcome to corporate America. They also tend to zone out during these meetings, whine about how annoying it is to have to be there, etc. This is an event that you are being INVITED to. You can choose to come… or NOT. It has the POTENTIAL to help you learn and become a better salesperson. YOU are NOT an EMPLOYEE. You are an INDEPENDENT contractor. If you want to make the most of your new career, go learn what has made other people successful. Guess what, it is going to COST you something. No one is going to hand it to you for free. Get over it
“no legitimate company” – where do you get off saying something like this. First off, the legitimacy of a company is based on it having something we call legal recognition… “In economics, a business is a legally-recognized organizational entity existing within an economically free country designed to sell goods and/or services to consumers, usually in an effort to generate profit.” It has nothing to do with their business plan. Mary Kay would not be in operation if they were not a legitimate company. The government will make sure of that. The inc. after their name is usually a pretty good “tell” on something like this. You MIGHT question their strategy, or their business model on this point, and say, “no company that wants to SURVIVE would dare…” but with 44 years or so behind them, I am not sure that you have any traction there either. Oh, and there you go using that EMPLOYEE word again. You are not an EMPLOYEE. This is your business. ACT like it!
“Thank God my sister in law is out of this CULT”?????? This is a popular term with the Pink Truth Gang. I will get into this more later when I have more time to really get into it, probably devote a section to explaining what a cult is and how to recognize one. Suffice to say, just because you don’t like the fact that other women are having fun, making money and meeting new people, does not mean that you get to call them a CULT. Mary Kay is not a cult. Is Mary Kay a cult? I’ll say it again. Mary Kay is not a cult
sayitaintso said:
She is probably having to pay back all what she spent on becoming a national. Think about how much money she put in personally to "make it happen" to "find a way make a way". I bet she has massive bills she needs to pay.
Really? Sayitaintso, Really? So YOU let yourself get sucked into a spending spree thinking that you could BUY your way to where this girl and others are. And because YOU did it, that must be how EVERYONE does it? And you DARE suggest that the ones that made it were simply MORE cunning and conniving than you. Sorry to pick on you exclusively, but I see this attitude all the time on Pink Truth. (in snide voice I am sure) “I bet she has massive bills she needs to pay” WHAT!!!???!?!?! You really think that someone can finance themselves to this level of sales!!!!!????? That there is no way that she EARNED this by helping one consultant at a time? Open your eyes people. She started out where EVERYONE starts. She sold. She recruited. She was good at it and I am sure that she had to learn a lot to get really good at it. Now she has what you couldn’t get so you take pot-shots at her from the side-lines? That’s ridiculous.
This and many of the events offered in Mary Kay may or may not be right for you. If you are a consultant and have opportunities like this, think about it. Go if you can. It can help you. If you let it. If you can’t go, don’t. Don’t think that going into debt for something is a good plan. Know your strengths, know your weaknesses. Always seek the wisdom of the people around you.
Don’t let people tell you what to believe. Not Mary Kay people, not Pink truth people. Think for yourself and make your own decisions. Mary Kay CAN be a really good thing. I have seen it first hand myself.
If you are wondering why I am so harsh on these Pink Truth folks, click here.
Thanks everyone.
A story about how much money you can potentially lose in Mary Kay.
and
An accusatory evaluation of a Mary Kay Event.
Click on the picture to see full size. Tonight I will focus on the latter.
I have been to many seminars and events in many different settings. It is almost always a given that the event organizer is going to make some money (often very good money). This particular event, and many like it, does not seem overpriced for what you are getting in exchange. For instance, Sean Key, the Vice President of Sales Development for all of Mary Kay is a very charismatic individual that is both entertaining and motivational. I am not sure what kind of price tag a guy like that fetches for a speaking engagement, but he is certainly a value add.
So we come to it. A sales representative for Mary Kay reaches a significant milestone in her career. National Sales Director takes a lot of hard work and focused determination. She naturally sets up an event to celebrate this accomplishment with all the people that helped her get there. Instead of just getting these people together for snacks and punch, she decides to bring some folks to the event that will help train, inform, and motivate the guests that she has invited.
All of this takes a lot of effort and costs a lot of money. Most event coordinators that I have talked to expect to make between $20k and $50k for a single event. That is the coordinator, not the person financing the event. Now this particular event may be considerably smaller than the ones my friends have put together but nonetheless, if she made money in the process of helping other women get excited about their careers, what is wrong with that?
Regarding the math on this post. (again, click the picture below to see it full size, or click here)
Lets just use the 500 people scenario. At full price -$110.00 you have $55,000! I know, I know that is a big number! How could a person take ALL THAT MONEY and not be an evil monster? Lets look at some of the expenses that are going to eat up that money. I will try to stay low on my estimates here to add to the possibility of lending credence to this MASSIVE rip off that Pink Truth is decrying.
$55,000 Income
- $2,000 Meeting space ($1,000/day)
- $20,000 Food – ($10/person/meal) 500 people, 2 meals (dinner/luncheon) – $10,000 if we assume meals are $5/person –unlikely
- $3,000 Guest Speakers – This is assuming that you can get these guys to come speak at an event for $1,000 dollars. That barely covers airfare, hotel and food so they would basically be doing this as a favor for this debuting NSD (if that is the case)
- $4,000 Labor – Assuming that all the processing of paperwork, mailings, phone work, reservations, set up of sound systems, worship team, coordinating guest speakers, and everything else is this “cheap”
Grand Total for Event - $29,000 leaving $26,000 dollars for this NSD who probably put enough effort into this to earn that figure.
More likely, the numbers will be something like
- $5,000 Meeting space
- $30,000 Food
- $9,000 Guest Speakers
- $6,000 Labor
Leaving $5,000 for the new NSD who has probably invested a considerable amount of her personal time in this project.
Which number is accurate? I can’t say, but what I can say is that:
It probably wasn’t quite the “pretty nice paycheck when all is said and done” picture that Tracy painted for this post.
Even if she did MAKE $50,ooo by putting this together, there is nothing wrong with that. Maybe you should put together an event like this. Its done all the time. They are called SEMINARS. Some can cost upwards of $1,200 per person – and they don’t feed you at those!
Some comments:
steph53282 said:
It's $110 plus lodging? Seriously? You are paying for one dinner and one lunch...that's it. I am appalled. Another $129 for lodging. You are paying for her to have a party about herself. She needs to pay for everything. Guests will be free I'm sure. Plus her directors will have to get her a gift, that is so expensive. How much does it cost for NSD's and special guests to come to a debut and speak. Doesn't GMB and PS always do debuts?
This is the epitome of lame, whiny, excuse making crybabies that inspired me to create this site…. “she needs to pay for everything”???? What kind of twisted attitude is that? Someone goes out of her way to include you in an event that could help you improve yourself, enjoy yourself, and have fun with others, and you say “she needs to pay for everything”????? This makes me sick!!! She achieved something that you didn’t, so SHE should PAY for YOU???? Outrageous!! This should be a time of celebration and anticipation of growth. Pony Up. If you don’t have the dough, stay home. No one is saying you have to go! For that matter, this wasn’t even sent to you. It was designed for someone else. You are appalled? I am appalled!!!!
Theory said:
1)…”Employees are reimbursed in full for all food, and pay for their lodging on an agency credit card for work travel. 100% free for them.”
2)…. “The bottom line is, no legitimate company would dare to charge employees for work related travel, food or lodging.”
3) …. “Thank God my sister in law is out of this cult and awaiting her refund. MKC in no way even resembles a real business!”
EMPLOYEES are reimbursed… First of all your talking about employees being REQUIRED to go to an event. OF COURSE they don’t pay a dime. Welcome to corporate America. They also tend to zone out during these meetings, whine about how annoying it is to have to be there, etc. This is an event that you are being INVITED to. You can choose to come… or NOT. It has the POTENTIAL to help you learn and become a better salesperson. YOU are NOT an EMPLOYEE. You are an INDEPENDENT contractor. If you want to make the most of your new career, go learn what has made other people successful. Guess what, it is going to COST you something. No one is going to hand it to you for free. Get over it
“no legitimate company” – where do you get off saying something like this. First off, the legitimacy of a company is based on it having something we call legal recognition… “In economics, a business is a legally-recognized organizational entity existing within an economically free country designed to sell goods and/or services to consumers, usually in an effort to generate profit.” It has nothing to do with their business plan. Mary Kay would not be in operation if they were not a legitimate company. The government will make sure of that. The inc. after their name is usually a pretty good “tell” on something like this. You MIGHT question their strategy, or their business model on this point, and say, “no company that wants to SURVIVE would dare…” but with 44 years or so behind them, I am not sure that you have any traction there either. Oh, and there you go using that EMPLOYEE word again. You are not an EMPLOYEE. This is your business. ACT like it!
“Thank God my sister in law is out of this CULT”?????? This is a popular term with the Pink Truth Gang. I will get into this more later when I have more time to really get into it, probably devote a section to explaining what a cult is and how to recognize one. Suffice to say, just because you don’t like the fact that other women are having fun, making money and meeting new people, does not mean that you get to call them a CULT. Mary Kay is not a cult. Is Mary Kay a cult? I’ll say it again. Mary Kay is not a cult
sayitaintso said:
She is probably having to pay back all what she spent on becoming a national. Think about how much money she put in personally to "make it happen" to "find a way make a way". I bet she has massive bills she needs to pay.
Really? Sayitaintso, Really? So YOU let yourself get sucked into a spending spree thinking that you could BUY your way to where this girl and others are. And because YOU did it, that must be how EVERYONE does it? And you DARE suggest that the ones that made it were simply MORE cunning and conniving than you. Sorry to pick on you exclusively, but I see this attitude all the time on Pink Truth. (in snide voice I am sure) “I bet she has massive bills she needs to pay” WHAT!!!???!?!?! You really think that someone can finance themselves to this level of sales!!!!!????? That there is no way that she EARNED this by helping one consultant at a time? Open your eyes people. She started out where EVERYONE starts. She sold. She recruited. She was good at it and I am sure that she had to learn a lot to get really good at it. Now she has what you couldn’t get so you take pot-shots at her from the side-lines? That’s ridiculous.
This and many of the events offered in Mary Kay may or may not be right for you. If you are a consultant and have opportunities like this, think about it. Go if you can. It can help you. If you let it. If you can’t go, don’t. Don’t think that going into debt for something is a good plan. Know your strengths, know your weaknesses. Always seek the wisdom of the people around you.
Don’t let people tell you what to believe. Not Mary Kay people, not Pink truth people. Think for yourself and make your own decisions. Mary Kay CAN be a really good thing. I have seen it first hand myself.
If you are wondering why I am so harsh on these Pink Truth folks, click here.
Thanks everyone.
Thursday, October 4, 2007
Is this a lie?
Pink Truth posted this today calling it the Mary Kay "lie of the week" -
Wanted: Enterprising woman to achieve unlimited earning potential while enriching the lives of others. Work duties include meeting new friends, interacting with prospective clients, as well supporting the community of women. Candidate will have the opportunity to make own hours, and will be compensated for their achievements with prizes and vacations.
Does this job sound appealing? Then you might have just what it takes to be one of 750,000 women already living the life as a consultant. As an Independent Beauty consultant you'll have the freedom to make your own work hours and set time a side for your family. And with distribution to more than 36 countries, you'll be able to work virtually anywhere in the world! No experience required and you can work part-time or full-time from your own home. You will have great benefits of owning your own business.
The comments from "pink truthers" range from...
"Who put this out? They ought to be hung by their toenails over a vat of extra emollient night cream..and released! (Picture the sound effect!!) "
to
"I thought MK Corp was cracking down on SD's for exagerating the "Opportunity"? It's an outright lie that you can disribute to 36 countries. Only NSD's can recruit in another country and I don't think even NSD's can sell in another country....What a crock!!!"
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, obviously not everyone is going to find this opportunity as good as others. I don't think that this was implied... correct me if I am wrong, but there are a lot of "mights" and "ifs" in there. I mean, honestly does it get any less manipulative or deceptive. "are you interested in.....? then you might like this....!" It doesn't get much simpler.
C'mon guys, not everything in Mary Kay is as evil as you think it is!
Wanted: Enterprising woman to achieve unlimited earning potential while enriching the lives of others. Work duties include meeting new friends, interacting with prospective clients, as well supporting the community of women. Candidate will have the opportunity to make own hours, and will be compensated for their achievements with prizes and vacations.
Does this job sound appealing? Then you might have just what it takes to be one of 750,000 women already living the life as a consultant. As an Independent Beauty consultant you'll have the freedom to make your own work hours and set time a side for your family. And with distribution to more than 36 countries, you'll be able to work virtually anywhere in the world! No experience required and you can work part-time or full-time from your own home. You will have great benefits of owning your own business.
The comments from "pink truthers" range from...
"Who put this out? They ought to be hung by their toenails over a vat of extra emollient night cream..and released! (Picture the sound effect!!) "
to
"I thought MK Corp was cracking down on SD's for exagerating the "Opportunity"? It's an outright lie that you can disribute to 36 countries. Only NSD's can recruit in another country and I don't think even NSD's can sell in another country....What a crock!!!"
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, obviously not everyone is going to find this opportunity as good as others. I don't think that this was implied... correct me if I am wrong, but there are a lot of "mights" and "ifs" in there. I mean, honestly does it get any less manipulative or deceptive. "are you interested in.....? then you might like this....!" It doesn't get much simpler.
C'mon guys, not everything in Mary Kay is as evil as you think it is!
First Post - My Purpose for Creating this Blog
I discovered a website recently that caught my attention. If you are reading this blog, you probably have seen it. It is called Pink Truth and claims to have "facts, opinions, and the real story behind Mary Kay Cosmetics".
As I have perused their website I have been through several phases of interest in what is being portrayed by these former Mary Kay Consultants. What began as intrigue and concern for a handful of hapless victims became horror as I realized that there were more than just one or two examples of people being burned by this organization. Then, as I dug deeper into the site I began to see some discrepancies and holes in the stories, testimonies and complaints that were (are) being voiced.
I have witnessed first hand, the enjoyment, fulfillment and success that my wife has experienced with her involvement in Mary Kay. I have also spent time with some of the great friends that she has made in the last year and a half and they also have had (and are having) an entirely positive experience.
So here is the problem for me. There are people having a great time selling Mary Kay products. There are other people that did not have a great time selling Mary Kay (for whatever reason) and are now very outspoken about their bad experience. This is not really a problem. After all, “You can make SOME of the people happy ALL of the time, you can make ALL of the people happy SOME of the time, but you can’t make ALL the people happy ALL the time”. The problem arises when those portraying their bad experience depict it as more that just a bad experience. My contention and frustration with Pink Truth is that they are representing Mary Kay as a sort of “evil empire” that is preying on poor innocent women with nothing but pure malice and greed.
I recognize that there are flaws within the Mary Kay Corporation. However, I don’t believe that Mary Kay is as bad as Pink Truth would have you believe. So, I have decided to create a response to Pink Truth. Ironically, Pink Truth, claiming to be exposing the half-truths and lies of Mary Kay, has begun to tell quite a few of their own! Since I am no longer welcome to post on their site (I wasn’t anti-Mary Kay enough apparently) I will reply to their posts here. I hope that as you peruse this site, you will get a balanced view of the Mary Kay opportunity.
In closing, I do not think that the Mary Kay opportunity is for everyone. I believe that there are certain Directors, Team Leaders, and even Consultants that have misrepresented Mary Kay and misled desperate people into making really bad decisions. But, and I stress the importance of this statement, there are a lot of really great experiences to be had, incredible product to sell, and there is NO need to sacrifice your values or integrity to make decent, good or even great money with this opportunity. I will be honest about what I have observed as my wife progresses through the highs and lows of Mary Kay life. I will also represent as honestly as possible the experiences, good and bad, of all current and former Mary Kay Consultants.
If you are considering joining Mary Kay, let me tell you that it has the potential to be the best opportunity of your life. Please research the pros and cons carefully and consider the decision you are making before you do anything. If you are ever asked to do something that runs contrary to your values don’t do it. If you want to ask any specific questions, leave me a comment here.
Mary Kay Reps that want to speak up, please feel free!! I want this to be balanced and fact based. Please help me create an environment that is not biased. I want people to tell their stories here. Good and bad. So fire away!
Thanks everyone.
As I have perused their website I have been through several phases of interest in what is being portrayed by these former Mary Kay Consultants. What began as intrigue and concern for a handful of hapless victims became horror as I realized that there were more than just one or two examples of people being burned by this organization. Then, as I dug deeper into the site I began to see some discrepancies and holes in the stories, testimonies and complaints that were (are) being voiced.
I have witnessed first hand, the enjoyment, fulfillment and success that my wife has experienced with her involvement in Mary Kay. I have also spent time with some of the great friends that she has made in the last year and a half and they also have had (and are having) an entirely positive experience.
So here is the problem for me. There are people having a great time selling Mary Kay products. There are other people that did not have a great time selling Mary Kay (for whatever reason) and are now very outspoken about their bad experience. This is not really a problem. After all, “You can make SOME of the people happy ALL of the time, you can make ALL of the people happy SOME of the time, but you can’t make ALL the people happy ALL the time”. The problem arises when those portraying their bad experience depict it as more that just a bad experience. My contention and frustration with Pink Truth is that they are representing Mary Kay as a sort of “evil empire” that is preying on poor innocent women with nothing but pure malice and greed.
I recognize that there are flaws within the Mary Kay Corporation. However, I don’t believe that Mary Kay is as bad as Pink Truth would have you believe. So, I have decided to create a response to Pink Truth. Ironically, Pink Truth, claiming to be exposing the half-truths and lies of Mary Kay, has begun to tell quite a few of their own! Since I am no longer welcome to post on their site (I wasn’t anti-Mary Kay enough apparently) I will reply to their posts here. I hope that as you peruse this site, you will get a balanced view of the Mary Kay opportunity.
In closing, I do not think that the Mary Kay opportunity is for everyone. I believe that there are certain Directors, Team Leaders, and even Consultants that have misrepresented Mary Kay and misled desperate people into making really bad decisions. But, and I stress the importance of this statement, there are a lot of really great experiences to be had, incredible product to sell, and there is NO need to sacrifice your values or integrity to make decent, good or even great money with this opportunity. I will be honest about what I have observed as my wife progresses through the highs and lows of Mary Kay life. I will also represent as honestly as possible the experiences, good and bad, of all current and former Mary Kay Consultants.
If you are considering joining Mary Kay, let me tell you that it has the potential to be the best opportunity of your life. Please research the pros and cons carefully and consider the decision you are making before you do anything. If you are ever asked to do something that runs contrary to your values don’t do it. If you want to ask any specific questions, leave me a comment here.
Mary Kay Reps that want to speak up, please feel free!! I want this to be balanced and fact based. Please help me create an environment that is not biased. I want people to tell their stories here. Good and bad. So fire away!
Thanks everyone.
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