Pink Truth: We are not sure if religion should be used to manipulate or not...

...safe to say, concerning Pink Truth, manipulating scripture to manipulate people is A-OKAY. If someone else even mentions scripture... they are "amusing" to the folks at Pink Truth.

Here is the link to both "articles"

"PinkPeace" really puts a strain on the "lusting in your heart" part of the Sermon on the mount.

Pink Truth LOVES it when people talk about God. They can make fun of them then.



What I find interesting is that they (Pink Truth) did not even bother to go to the trouble of separating these articles from each other... they are either that unaware of their own hypocrisy or they (specifically Tracy) realize that their readers will literally call them on nothing, so why not just fly it in everyone's face.

Pink Truth: We are so scared of the truth that we make fun of it.

Pink Truth tries pathetically to twist Mary Kay teaching

A real shame that in the midst of all the economic, emotional and other turmoil brewing in the world today one of the few encouraging "lights" trying to help guide a change in perspective is being shot at by people who can't tell the difference between sound advice and manipulation.

No longer shocking, but still disappointing.

Your thoughts?

Pink Truth: Mary Kay should not pre-judge people... we should

Pink Truth analyzes Mary Kay 'recruiting' script

I am a very analytical person. As a result, I prefer to look at numbers. I don't want to have my objections overcome before I even think of them.

I want to know what I am being offered (Purchases, Job Opportunities, etc.) before I start asking questions about whether or not it is right for me.

In other words, don't tell me, "This job will be perfect for you (operative word, "you") ..." when you don't know me.

This is one of the things that I personally do not like about Mary Kay and other similar marketing plans. They tend to require the type of thinking (and talking) that tries to eliminate objections before they even materialize. I don't think this is necessarily wrong, it just doesn't suit me at all. (Like I said, I am analytical)

Ironically, this is also the thing that irritates me about Pink Truth. By making assumptions about the women in Mary Kay (based on their personal interactions), they write off people they don't know and dissuade (or attempt to dissuade) other people they don't know with alleged omniscience... claiming to offer the "truth".

Thoughts?

Pink Truth: And now for something completely different... nevermind, business as usual, 'we hate Mary Kay'

Nonsense

One thing that I will have to thank raisinberry for here is that I realized (as I kept labeling things "nonsense" that if this site is going to be a reliable source of information about Mary Kay, I need to stop only pointing out how unreliable certain sources are. This site needs to add some value by pointing out credible sources, both positive and negative, that have expressed facts and/or opinions about Mary Kay.

Starting with this one that was sort of contributed by a Pink Truther in the comments section of "raisinberry"'s rant.

CBS Story on Mary Kay Cosmetics

Also see the video version here

Feel free to add your thoughts about either of these.

And, please send me any "breaking news" updates you come across from reputable sources (or less than reputable sources... as you know, we talk about those here too!)

Thanks

Pink Truth: We must be right, look how poorly our critics make their case against us.

Pink Truth rolls out another Mary Kay criticism of Pink Truth

Does anyone else get the feeling that Pink Truth is more interested in arguing for the sake of arguing than their alleged goal of discovering the truth?

It seems clear to me.

Pink Truth: Prizes can be bought cheaper than they can be earned, so they are valueless

Pink Truth still doesn't get that you aren't supposed to buy Mary Kay prizes

The Scribbler has done "the backbreaking work so you can laugh at it later...."

In other words, she has calculated how much you would have to spend to "buy" the prizes that you are supposed to earn.

If you are just 'doing your job' and earn these prizes above and beyond the money you are earning by selling product, shouldn't the numbers be more like "I saved..." or "I got .... extra, just for fun".

Has anyone in the history of Mary Kay honestly genuinely thought to themselves, "'...paying $1800 for a digital photo keychain!' no way I can get a better deal than that"?

Somehow, I doubt it.

Sorry, "scrib" funny, but this doesn't really make sense.

A for effort.

Pink Truth: Mary Kay and Touch of Pink - more pink to get your week started

Pink Truth's update on Mary Kay's lawsuit against Touch of Pink

Any thoughts?

Pink Truth: Mary Kay "defenders" should not be alowed to do what we do

Nonsense

Finally, someone sends a letter to Pink Truth that makes about as much sense as most of their rants. At least now they will listen, right?

Seriously, the arguments that this "alleged" writer makes are as non sequitur as the ones Pink Truth enjoys making.

Unfortunately, it clearly does not help to "speak their language", and they hate her as much as anyone else that disagrees with "the greater good" that Pink Truth aims to create.

Honestly, this letter is more likely fabricated or "touched up" or taken out of its original context. Nonetheless, observing the viciousness that ensues from people that apparently believe the integrity of the letter, you would think that they believe they do not engage in the same unintelligible criticism that they are being presented with.

If they were trying to be funny (Pink Truth), this would be a massive success story.

Consider how much more humorous this is than the standard, "Don't $&#*ing use foul language" type comment. It is "funny" because the behavior that is being criticized is being used to form the criticism.

As I said, I don't think that Pink Truth is trying to be funny, so this actually comes across as very sad.

Pink Truth: Mary Kay and Maggots?

Mary Kay, Pink Truth and Maggots?

I like "The Scribbler", really I do. She seems to be capable of putting her thoughts into writing in a way that most people never quite grasp. More so than me, I think.

I do think that she has gotten caught up a little too much in the Pink Truth hype that everyone in Mary Kay is the same robotic, ordering machine with no brains or personal thinking skills, and that is a shame. But, I do get the feeling that, if anyone on Pink Truth is being ironic and using sarcasm and exaggeration as writing tools, it is her.

That said, I think this article is interesting. I am almost positive that she is not being ironic, but in an environment (Pink Truth) that tirelessly connects "odds" with "chances" and whines about "market saturation" with no clue what those two words mean and protests people making "it sound so easy" just because "they are doing it", isn't it a little ironic that she would use a tv show about maggot farming to make a case for "something better than Mary Kay"?

I mean, really, isn't maggot farming kind of a specialty field? This is not something that you get into "for the money"!

Oooh, let me start a maggot farm. It sure would beat selling cosmetics!

Also, interesting that she did not list any of the maggot farmers expenses! I am sure that the couple on the show process and ship ALL 3 to 4 million maggots every week! (I didn't see the show, but I would guess that they have some overhead - like employees and equipment and repairs... etc, etc, etc)

Now, I also need to address one of the themes that I have been seeing surface on Pink Truth a lot lately. Havurah, I think, got this theme heated up most recently. (BTW, Havurah, I have still not heard from you...)

There seems to be this belief, amongst Pink Truth regulars, that Mary Kay claims that they are the only way to do or be anything. That if Mary Kay was as successful as they claim, or as ministry minded as they suggest that there could be no other outlet for these things.

"If Mary Kay was really so great, there would be no need for brick and mortar businesses"

The Scribbler, here, suggests:

"Let’s talk about the ministry issue. One of NSD Rena Tarbet’s objection overcomers reassures potential recruits that, “In Mary Kay, you have the greatest opportunity to touch people for the Lord as well as for Mary Kay.” If Tarbet is correct, that means that every opportunity in existence – in the eyes of God – is kitty kibble compared to the Mary Kay opportunity. Tarbet’s claim is implying that if you want to please God and serve Him fully, you have to be in Mary Kay."

This is either incredibly naive and ignorant, unlikely for such a skilled communicator as "The Scribbler" has proven herself, or it is an incredibly manipulative abuse of the intended context of Rena's words.

Either way, it proves to be an absurd assumption about Mary Kay that is simply not based on anything logical.

I think that Google provides the "...greatest opportunity to search the internet..."

I think that Nike provides the "...greatest sports apparel for serious athletes..."

I think that Prego is the "...greatest tasting pasta sauce..."

But none of those opinions mean that if someone uses Yahoo, Adidas, or Ragu they are somehow out of the will of God.

On a more "religious" note, I prefer the New King James Version, "Pre-Tribulation Rapture", Salvation by grace, not works, but I don't consider someone "out of the will of God" if they disagree with me.

To say that, because Rena said, "In Mary Kay, you have the greatest opportunity to touch people for the Lord..." she thinks any other opportunity to do so is insignificant, is ludicrous. Plain and simple.

To try to make that quote suggest the same is, simply, manipulative... and wrong.

Putting words into a person's mouth in order to prove one's own point is not only reprehensible, but proves the weakness of one's position.

Disappointing.

Pink Truth: We are afraid of taking risks... That is why Mary Kay scares us

Pink Truth clearly illustrates their inability to grasp the difference between percentages and chances

I would like to point out two things about Tracy's evaluation of Amy, the director that she calls into question in this post.

First, the $130,000 that Tracy calculated does not include personal sales. I am constantly in awe that Pink Truth is so convinced that, literally, no one in Mary Kay sells any product that they never count that toward a directors income. As I understand it, a director (as the example in a unit) is supposed to be the number one consultant in her unit. I am sure that does not always happen, but I know my wife's director has a very nice customer base herself. I won't speculate about how much Amy earns from her personal sales, perhaps someone from Pink Truth would like to come over here and take care of that for us? But suffice to say that $130K is only from her commission(s).

Second, how many companies can Tracy name that have even 63 people making more than $100K? I mean, sure, go ahead and poo-poo "only" 63 people that make more than $100K, but at least give us a small list of other companies that are paying out those kind of commissions on a regular basis.

But outside of that, the truly striking element of this post, to me, is that Pink Truth seems to (and Tracy obviously does, based on her direct comments) believe that just because a relatively small percentage of people accomplish something, your chances must be small.

Based on Pink Truth's mindset, clearly illustrated with this article, you should not aspire to do anything that has odds that are stacked against you.

Forget professional sports. HA!

Don't try to be an executive of anything. Do you know what the percentage is of people that accomplish that? HA!

Don't try to start your own small business. You will be doomed! HA!

For that matter, you probably shouldn't even get married.

I don't often say this, because it really is fairly irrelevant. I personally do not have any desire to sign up to work in an MLM sales type environment. I know that it is not a match for my personality. It does not "work" for me. I would, most likely, not be successful. However, these "odds", the small percentage of people that "make" it, is exactly what would appeal to me. I love a challenge. I want to go through basic training as a Navy SEAL, just because I know how hard it is, and I would love to be one of the few that come out on the other side. The fact that Pink Truth sees this as a downside that would, undoubtedly, cause potential recruits to, "...reac if they were told up front that they had almost no chance of making an executive income in Mary Kay...", seems to be very telling about their character.

Thoughts?

Pink Truth: Mary Kay Women Don't Deserve Privacy... because we said so

Pink Truth loves invading privacy... in the name of "their" "truth"

I can't do anything about the fact that Pink Truth could care less about getting permission from the people they love to slander. This woman wrote a personal email to her friends and family. (Assuming that this is not a made up email.)

Not knowing anything about her audience and the relationship that she has with them, one would think that anyone publishing such a message would be, at the very least, cautious about what they assume, but we are talking about Pink Truth, so I suppose we should not be surprised.

Nonetheless, because it has been published, and because Pink Truth has had the chance to rip this girl to ribbons with their assumptions, I believe that it can at least be used as a case study.

It seems to me that there are elements of this email that reflect the way most of the readers on this site feel:

The way I'm going to finish DIQ is to meet ALOT of women.

This is the bottom line. You really need to meet a lot of women in order to progress.

There are also a lot of things that will make most readers here uneasy:

...and you'll be doing me an enormous favor. Seriously, second to prayer this is my biggest need.

So, keep in mind that this may not represent an actual person but that it may, in fact, represent a real person with real feelings that sent this to real people that knew her a lot better than anyone on the internet does.

All of that being said, any thoughts? This should be a good one from everyone.

Pink Truth: We are so much better than Mary Kay... at everything

Nonsense

Pink Truth, in their strong conviction that their small club are the only people in the world with intelligence and taste, have struck a death blow to Mary Kay by defiantly posting information that is supposed to be kept quiet for another quarter.

*gasp*

They are so on top of it.

Hint to consultants that are using Pink Truth's advice to plan your Mary Kay business.

First of all, don't.

But, failing that, at least save yourself some energy and realize that there will ALWAYS be something else coming (next quarter, next month, next year, etc.) so you might as well never order at all.

Mary Kay's point, as I understand it, is, "Don't order product to win a prize, don't wait to order product to win a prize; Order product when you need it, and only when you need it." If Pink Truth, your director, or your recruiter (or anyone for that matter) tells you different, don't listen.

Pink Truth: Even More Nonsense about Mary Kay

Nonsense

Pink Truth's own "raisinberry" contributed this piece.

Anyone care to chime in?

Pink Truth: More Nonsense about Mary Kay

Nonsense

I thought that yesterdays post was an excellent example of why Pink Truth should neither be taken seriously, nor presumed to be attempting any sort of serious critique of Mary Kay. I still stand by that, but submit to you the comments on this letter from an outspoken critic.

As someone on this site (Balanced Mary Kay) recently pointed out, the first comment (and one that agreed with the first) claims that this letter writer has no credibility because she has not sold Mary Kay herself (no mention of the fact that she is a consumer and has interaction with consultants) while there are clearly "credible" members of the Pink Truth community that have never sold Mary Kay.

Hmmm. That's interesting.

Especially since she just criticized this type of thinking (or lack of thinking) with her somewhat witty, "if you don’t share my miserable experience, you are an idiot.com" comment! Clearly that is the prerequisite for being taken seriously on Pink Truth - Agree with the groupthink and you are intelligent; disagree and you are in need of tutoring.

For instance, "pinkpeace" adds:

pinkpeace said:


I do not sale MK, but I do use the products and have friends that sale.


Maybe she can ask one of her college-degreed consultant friends to provide some English tutoring along with that TimeWise cleanser.

Sigh. Now I have to go to confession for being mean.


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Mon 26 Jan 06:51
Votes: +3

I can't say that I ever recall "pinkpeace" having a problem with anyone else's English.

Is it just me?

And finally, for good measure, "pinksedition" wraps up my exact thoughts about Pink Truth.

pinksedition said:
Really, does anyone ever really try to make some intellectual remarks arguing about this site? It is the same rhetoric over and over again and it sounds more stupid every time I read it.

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Really, "pinksedition", does Pink Truth ever really try to do what you are asking for? Or is it also the same rhetoric over and over again that sounds more stupid every time I read it?

Pink Truth: Nonsense about Mary Kay

This is a two part post.

Part 1
Part 2
(part two is addressed to Havurah, who is still refusing to comment on this site and is using "Google locked me out" as a weak excuse. Click Here to skip to that part)
Part 3
(part three is my response to "blessed", a.k.a. all I have to about this nonsense.)


Nonsense

I nearly did not link to this article. Speaking to, or for that matter, about, "blessed" is futile.

The very fact that Tracy not only allows his nonsense on her site but, in fact, publishes it on the front page demonstrates that she is not serious in her criticism of Mary Kay.

Are there flaws with Mary Kay's business model? No doubt. In fact, we discuss them on this site -- and I am sure that they are brought up at corporate headquarters on a daily basis.

Is comparing a cosmetics company (or its marketing plan) to a social disease, a cult or a plague helpful in any way? I say, no.

I have made very clear my belief that Tracy is, to say the least, misleading many about her intentions with Pink Truth. Her deception and, frankly, outright lies are what motivate me to keep this site in existence.

That she has a problem with Mary Kay does not bother me.

That she actively campaigns to smear honest and integrous women with no concern for the truth is despicable. This post from "blessed", who has allowed his outrage at what happened to him and his wife (he has not actually told us what happened, so we can only guess that it must have been pretty bad) to consume him with with an illogical and ignorant belief that anyone involved with Mary Kay must be either knowingly or unknowingly complicit in the scam-to-end-all-scams, and must be stopped at any cost.

I do, however, believe that they are aware, to some degree, that their position (extreme hatred against anything and anyone involved with Mary Kay) is not bulletproof. This is evidenced by the fact that neither of them will allow dissenting opinions. Tracy avoids it by only having conversation in places where she can control the outcome, and "blessed" by not ever responding to the questions that are asked of him.

This, to me, is sad.



Finally, "havurah", in the comments on this post (the one that I linked to by "blessed") responded to my request for her to be respectful enough to comment over here, by either feigning ignorance or being to lazy to actually read what was said here.

So I will clarify... and this time, I will try to make it simple.

Havurah:

No one here suggested that Tracy "locked you out" of anything.

There is nothing wrong with creating an account with the name(s) "havurah1" "havvie" or any other such pseudonym that will be easily recognized and starting your comment with, "this is "Havurah" from Pink Truth. We will all know who you are. Plus your now famous third person monologue(s) should be easy to spot.

What we did ask you, specifically, was why your comment that referenced this site by the name "The Truth About Mary Kay" was suddenly censored to read "*********"

Was that your doing?

Or were you censored because the owner of the site is threatened by this little slice of truth over here on the other side of the internet?

Either way, how does that stack up in your evaluation of Pink Truth?

Finally, I would like to emphasize, I am calling you out. I believe that you are hiding from having an open discussion with an audience that is not censored by Tracy. None of your excuses for not leaving a comment and having a conversation, to date, hold any water.

You seem to hold what I at first interpreted as a strong set of values: honor and respect, specifically. I hope that you will prove me right and show this site the respect of visiting and explaining how you can support a cause like Pink Truth when even you yourself have been either voluntarily or obligatorily censored. This is clearly a paradox for a site claiming to be offering THE truth, don't you think?

It is your move. I hope that you will respect me (and if not me, at least your own values) enough to come visit and explain this apparent contradiction.

Pink Truth: One Mary Kay Consultant confesses to "doing it fast"... this means all Mary Kay Consultants do it this way

Pink Truth "I-Story"


Everyone has a story. Seems to me... from where I am sitting... that some are good... and some are bad.


What do you think?

Pink Truth: Mary Kay consultant numbers are down, this IS significant

Pink Truth, in their ongoing attempt to prove that Mary Kay is no good, points to an apparent decrease in U.S. Consultant numbers as just the kind of evidence they are looking for

What do all of you say? 700K to 600K seems like a considerable number. Is this evidence of "downsizing" or something more dramatic?

In other, lighter notes, Steelers won the Superbowl and I should be back on a regular schedule with the posting. Thanks for your patience.

Some Mary Kay Points and Pink Truth Counter-Points

Written by "pinkpeace", this piece has a decent amount of insight into the Pink Truth contentions against Mary Kay.

Any thoughts?

P.S. I have been doing (and will be doing) a little bit of traveling, so apologies for any sporadic nature of posts. Thanks for understanding.

Pink Truth: The Facts are these; We make up the facts and they are facts because we say they are

Want to read what Pink Truth calls facts? Click here.

Wow. This goes beyond wild. I can think of no greater demonstration of why I simply can't take literally anything that Pink Truth says. In fact, it is exactly this kind of post that makes me wonder if they are not all being facetious about the whole thing. I seriously have a hard time believing that anyone could actually say (or, in this case, write) these things with a straight face. I know I couldn't.

"jta" says,

"Fact 1: The majority of Sales Directors make very little money.

...To check this fact, you can do a couple of things. One real eye opener is to ask the Directors you admire to provide their 1099s for the last few years...

...Another easy way to check this is to take a look at the Applause magazine..."

(emphasis mine)

JTA,

Suppose, if you will, that someone reading your article took your advice and asked the "Directors you admire" for their 1099s. Let's further suppose that they have several Directors they admire. Let's further suppose that all the directors that this anonymous reader queries turn out to make less money than they seemed to be claiming. Moreover, let's FURTHER suppose they make (as you say) "very little money" (Isn't this just as subjective as "executive income?).

How does this make "The majority of Sales Directors make very little money" a fact?

The FACT of the matter is that it does not. I suppose that I should not even ask, "how do you expect to be taken seriously when you say things like this?" because it is obvious that you don't.

Sorry to have wasted your time.

Pink Truth: Fun with religious manipulation - In Mary Kay and Out

Pink Truth Maintains that Mary Kay and God don't mix

Here is an interesting read for any of you that are actually still interested in what Pink Truth is ranting about these days.

On the surface, I would even (erroneously) suggest that this is "fresh" material.

"havurah", at first glance, seems to be taking a new angle on the whole Mary Kay situation.

Unfortunately, it is very difficult to find any consistent point, there are few points that she makes that are backed up with anything more than regurgitated Pink Truth propaganda, and the point that she does make - namely, that God is God, Cosmetics are Cosmetics, and Mary Kay is Mary Kay - is one that (for my money) everyone should either already know or stand to be manipulated by people claiming to speak on behalf of God (again).

Proof of concept? Look no further than Pink Truth. More specifically, look no further than the post that we are talking about here. One of Pink Truth's strongest, most persuasive, and most contentious arguments against Mary Kay is their own variety of religious manipulation.

And no, I am not referring to the ones that suggest that "using religion as a selling tactic" is wrong. Pink Truth(ers) (not all, but enough) use religious manipulation to bolster their argument for supporting Pink Truth. Much the same way they claim they were manipulated (and did manipulate) when they were in Mary Kay.

Since havurah clearly reads here, I wonder if she would care to clear up one thing for us? How is it that someone who claims to be crusading for the cause of separation of church and Mary Kay (or in this case some hybrid of Christianity and Judaism - and Mary Kay) feels the need to stir (or attempt to stir) the pot about people's belief systems?

Also, how is it that someone who understands this:

"MARY KAY INC., is simply a factory. If the MARY KAY CORP., MLM disappeared tomorrow the factory would still be churning out other label products for other clients."

Can have any problem with this company? Clearly, it is the very people that you are associating with now (Pink Truth) - the ones that got carried away with fanciful and fanatical imaginations, faced disillusionment, and are now fanatical in their opposition to, as you say, "a factory" - that are the problem here.

Don't get me wrong, there are clearly still plenty of the "fanciful fanatics" in Mary Kay... but you are clearly aligning yourself with the crowd that can't (or wont) let go of this unique brand of obsession. How can you, in good conscience, preach, "GOD is GOD and personal products are personal products and there is no nexus between them." to the "choir" of people (Pink Truth) that can't seem to grasp this.

My only guess is that you don't believe it yourself. Which would lead one, logically, to believe that you are only using all this rhetoric to rally the forces (Pink Truth) behind your fuzzy version of this strange manipulation game.

I know that you made a big "slip-up" by mentioning this site in the comments. (If you haven't already been, you should expect a rebuke from your fearless leader.) But for my part, I will express my gratitude for that kindness. Also, if your brashness leads to your eventual banning, please know that you are always welcome here. (More accurately, that should read "When" ...your brashness leads to...)

Meantime, please feel free to drop us a line here. We may not seem that exciting here, because, for the most part, we are the "boring", non-fanciful types that see Mary Kay the way that you claim to. It is just a company.

We promise. We wont bite. (too much)

P.S. (I try very hard to not us the "phrase" - LOL - , but I have to admit that I very much enjoyed "No, I am not Noam Chomsky" **LOL** (there, you got it out of me) ;)